Paragon downs Heroic LK 25

[Eaglestrike]

That does feel very wrong. Especially because one of the most potent mob AOE's in the game are flamestrikes (Old Kingdom's second half, HoR)

[fantasticdan]

The best Fire AoE damage is still far behind melee's incidental damage. Fire was 10%+ behind arcane before 3.3, and is still behind even after buffing. Also requires that every target has +13% magic and +5% crit bonus on it, which isn't going to happen. They're also more susceptible to evocation interrupts than arcane. It's pretty easy to see why mages got sat on that kill because of Spriest and lock's superior AoE. Esp since nothing out of phase 1 is targetable by blizzard/flamestrike, which makes up a large portion of mage AOE.

Because no one plays unholy right?

[D44kpunk]

15 STR is 30 AP straight up, before scaling with kings, fallen crusader, et al

No plate class should ever put 44 ap on their gloves

99% sure 44ap > 15 str for ret

[Plow]

ffs people... there's no mages because... dun dun dun... you have to fucking move...

a lot




and yes, ap gloves > str gloves for ret enchant

[Boyiee]

^ and warrior

[Tricen]

15 STR is only good for unholy DK lol.

[Falaras]

I thought Fire was on par if not better then arcane now, especially since ICC gear is overloaded with hit.

[Tulun]

So the overall impression is the Heroic version of this boss is actually retarded difficult? But in a good way.

But, with the normal versions of LK, everyone can beat him... just not everyone will truly beat him.
Blizzard walked the line well?

[Eaglestrike]

So the overall impression is the Heroic version of this boss is actually retarded difficult? But in a good way.

But, with the normal versions of LK, everyone can beat him... just not everyone will truly beat him.
Blizzard walked the line well?

Sure sounds like they did what they set out to accomplish for the most part.

[Boyiee]

All they have to do is continue to make an end boss just 4% too hard, then after a few weeks toss in a 5% raid buff and all is well.

[Plow]

So the overall impression is the Heroic version of this boss is actually retarded difficult? But in a good way.

But, with the normal versions of LK, everyone can beat him... just not everyone will truly beat him.
Blizzard walked the line well?

Not even close to everyone can beat LK25 normal even with 5% buff. With 30% it will eventually be damn near everyone, but even then there will be fail.


Most people haven't beaten LK10 normal yet.

[Arvin]

Normal LK10 lol

kingslayer may as well put on jenkins title on mal'ganis

[Tulun]

All they have to do is continue to make an end boss just 4% too hard, then after a few weeks toss in a 5% raid buff and all is well.

Heh. Interesting. Will the buff really scale up to 30%? That's kind of messed up...

[Noobta]

It won't be 30% until summer. Hopefully Cataclysm or beta is out by then

[Korietsu]

I thought Fire was on par if not better then arcane now, especially since ICC gear is overloaded with hit.

Arcane is still ~5% ahead of fire and even more so on movement fights. The hit cap isn't hard to reach, it's getting the correct amount of crit and haste.

Because no one plays unholy right?

In 25's thats not a problem, in 10's its a big deal. The harder part is really making sure that each target has the 5% crit debuff, and that they all at least live for 12 seconds.

The other part about mage AOE that's terrible is that you have to actually downrank to reach max DPS, since you have to stack FS rank 8 and 9 dot, then rotate with blizzard/LB's. Pretty much a load of bullshit.

That does feel very wrong. Especially because one of the most potent mob AOE's in the game are flamestrikes (Old Kingdom's second half, HoR)

Also have to remember that Mob FS is different from mage FS. Mob FS deals damage while you stand in it, mage FS applies the DoT after the initial damage. I honestly believe we should be able to explode our LB's on demand, similar to seed of corruption.

Also, this thread is fucking hilarious.
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...38544570&sid=1

OMG REMOVING BUFFS IS AN EXPLOIT, BAN. Seriously, removing buffs to manipulate health is probably something I would have looked at being a former FFXI player. Hell, you had to buff cancel to make sure you didn't die as RDM/NIN on solo events. Boggles me that everyone is crying foul over this.

[Norellicus]

The QQ is pretty funny but I also can't imagine that

a) They intended you to cheese the mechanic that way

b) It's actually more mana efficient to do that constant rebuffing, those group buffs are expensive; though it is more time/GCD efficient in terms of getting people healed to cancel the infest

Point b makes me think they won't actually 'nerf' this though since you're still incurring a heavy opportunity cost for it.

[Jodwahh]

Fort runescrolls, kings and druid drums means 0 mana costs. I'd imagine the only people with proper versions of the buffs are the tanks, they can pass the rebuffing to a dps class.

[Gulkeeva]

Heh. Interesting. Will the buff really scale up to 30%? That's kind of messed up...

yeah it sort of is... decent guilds will probably be downing most of ICC heroic by 15-20%, and hardcore-ish guilds will be farming LK by then.

Pugs will probably be clearing a decent amount of heroic icc25man by 30% (I know some pugs do heroic 10/25man airship battle on my server atm)

[Plow]

Also, this thread is fucking hilarious.
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...38544570&sid=1

OMG REMOVING BUFFS IS AN EXPLOIT, BAN. Seriously, removing buffs to manipulate health is probably something I would have looked at being a former FFXI player. Hell, you had to buff cancel to make sure you didn't die as RDM/NIN on solo events. Boggles me that everyone is crying foul over this.

Not sure what to think about this, really. It's definitely not your typical FFXI-style manipulation to activate latents and stuff...


Here's what they did:

Shitton of fort, mark, kings scrolls, 1 war for commanding.


5 paladins.


When infest is about to come, make sure fully buffed, and using a shadow aura mastery rotation so there's 1 up for each.


Soon as infest hits, everyone in raid has a macro that cancels fort, mark, kings, and commanding. With the damage lowered from the AM rotation, this is enough to straight up cancel infest on the spot, with no healing.


infest is entirely removed from healer responsibility.

Rebuffs are done with scrolls to eliminate mana expense.


Hence they go with 5 healers...

Hence they beat the enrage time when nobody else can...

Hence world first heroic LK25...

Not sure if approve.


Definitely disappointed that it's not a "pure" kill, at least.

[Plow]

Er, well, according to paragon they didn't do it now, apparently.