FFXIV Random Speculation/Question thread II: Let's Speculate the Speculations

[Jinko]

Oh we are back to keyboard/mouse vs keyboard/controller again are we.

It doesn't matter what any of us prefer, the fact still remains that SE should provide a control set up for both camps.

You do get used to FF11's controls but I would have rather they worked like every other MMO out there, its not guna happen because SE don't have enough experience with PC development, but we can all hope anyway.

@ FredtheTaru and Calemero, I get the feeling the hate/emnity system hasn't been tuned yet, probably why you are pulling hate so easily.

[Vydos]

Did the guild npcs tell you the recipes or was it just trial and error?

Any testers feel like answering the above question. I'm interested in it as well.

Do you need to buy recipes like in aion or is it the same system like in ffxi? (Or something different)

[Wycor]

Any testers feel like answering the above question. I'm interested in it as well.

Do you need to buy recipes like in aion or is it the same system like in ffxi? (Or something different)

Atm there is not system apart of the recipes we are learning from the Guildleves.

[Urza]

FFXI on PC was meant to be played with keyboard-only controls. Many asian PC games work like this if you've played any before. All you have to do is set the controls to "compact" keyboard and it's standard WASD movement. Given that we have what, 10 pages of 20 macros built into the game (not even considering the ease of use of windower macros), I don't see why going through menus should be considered a problem since you can map everything to hotkeys. The menus are actually easier to navigate if you don't use the mouse; the only reason I found to use the mouse in XI was to select a specific target in a swarm of mobs, which rarely happened.

There's 2 problems really. One is, unless you played alot you didn't even know about the macro system, let alone setting it up efficiently. The second is, why would you want to deal with all the extra steps when a click should be sufficient in all cases. Just watching this thread there's some complaints on targeting, which sounds to me entirely because its controller based. A mouse click or quick hit on Tab is almost impossible to mess up on targeting. Especially for healing party members rather than select skill, rotate through entire party/raid which could be 2 key presses or could be 20 with a gamepad, but with a mouse and keyboard its 1 or 2 period, a click or hotkey to pick the spell, and a click to pick a new target if you weren't already targeting who you want.

I'm willing to split the difference between 11 and WoW on the UI because I really do want to enjoy the game, but where most of you are losing the point is, you played 11, got used to it and accept it. Try asking your friends who tried 11 and couldn't get into it what their biggest gripes were, I guarantee they don't say end game.

I have gripes about the way chat works to, but they seem to not have all the new chat window functionality in place yet for filtering chat to different windows and its not a game breaker for me, but it certainly can hurt your game's popularity when people have trouble socializing because of a bad chat window. Theirs is very readable, but in the wild it doesn't look like its very easy to actually talk in chat if there's action going on. And since there's lots of people using a gamepad I doubt they'll be using ventrillo to talk. Of course, they probably won't be talking much if they use the gamepad, how does one converse in typed chat if you have to use a controller, or switch your hands between the keyboard and gamepad with any frequency.

WoW is the most popular MMO hands down. Its not because of the gameplay, or at least not only because of that. It became popular through word of mouth where people were playing and got their friends playing, and people stayed playing for years, literally hours every single day because of the friends they made in game. Thats facilitated through a great UI, easy to read chat, and reasons to converse such as battlegrounds or raid content. You could probably level in most any game with other people without having to talk, its the social aspects that keep people logging on long after the initial joys of a new game have worn off.

I'm not here to pick a fight on control schemes, I'm very invested in this game being good. I may think WoW is well made, but playing it nigh on 5 years, need something new, and I want it to be something I can get friends playing to, because that was what made any MMO good after the content was exhausted. What I'd really like to hear from people is how well the keyboard playing works in comparison to 11 and/or WoW.

The WALL O TEXT is much easier to do while using a keyboard, or ventrillo. My ability to communicate as a guild and raid leader was critical and lack of communication always meant issues be it a wipe or people fighting for silly reasons. Quiet people were more likely to leave a guild or quit the game because they weren't involved in the community.

[Urza]

Also, please alpha testers bug them for a recipe book. I don't think anyone can name a game in the last 5 years that didn't have recipes listed somewhere in game, at least after you learn them.

Its one thing to tab out for maps or strategies, but a recipe book is pretty standard at this point, like a quest log.

[Loaar]

Just watching this thread there's some complaints on targeting, which sounds to me entirely because its controller based. A mouse click or quick hit on Tab is almost impossible to mess up on targeting.

Actually thats wrong.

The issues are due to the alpha version of the system, nothing at all to do with the controller. In fact, I'm willing to bet most of the people complaining about targeting are not using a controller.

FYI, the mouse is still jerky and basicly unusable for doing anything quickly, and TAB cycles though all possible targets, including other players or NPCs, so its not great in its current form for selecting targets in a hurry.

Its been feedbacked more times than I can count by almost every person who has posted on the tester forums so I'm sure it won't be that way at release, but again, it has NOTHING to do with controllers.

I have gripes about the way chat works to, but they seem to not have all the new chat window functionality in place yet for filtering chat to different windows and its not a game breaker for me, but it certainly can hurt your game's popularity when people have trouble socializing because of a bad chat window.

Why complain about a chat system that will obviously change? Theres already another tab there thats just not usable right now, its obvious to even the stupidest people that this system won't be there at release.

how does one converse in typed chat if you have to use a controller, or switch your hands between the keyboard and gamepad with any frequency.

People managed it in FFXI just fine. Not sure what your point is tbh. There will be controls for the keyboard and mouse, there will be controls for the gamepad, what people will use will be a personal choice.

The UI and controls are nothing like FFXI was, your not forced into using macros or menus at all if you don't want to. I've been playing the alpha using just the keyboard WASD movement and using ENTER and the 1-9 buttons for skills and it works fine provided you dont get worked up over the fact that obvioulsy the controls and in a basic state and things like TAB targeting needs tweaking.

[Urza]

I could care less how other people play, so long as they can communicate easily and perform their in game tasks quickly and efficiently so as not to annoy other players. I do however care that the keyboard and mouse work much better than they did in 11.

From your comment, it sounds like it will, which is all i'm after on that point. The tab key issues hopefully can get split to a tab for target mob and something else to cycle through friends, not a big deal there.

The point of an alpha, generally speaking is to give feedback on things that aren't set up quite as good as the players would like. So why not bring it up that chat isn't very good right now and think about how it should be. If we say nothing they might think its fine some other way.

Given how Square came down on almost every site leaking info i'm rather sure they are looking at the popular sites. I just wish they'd have their own official Square forums beyond the tester forums. It would be nice to converse directly rather than hoping to glean info from testers and hoping they give input off the forums to Square. Since the beta might start soon the more input they get now the better for everyone.

Not being in the alpha, I haven't been able to tell what changes have been put in with each patch so seeing a persistent issue is worrisome.

[Loaar]

They aren't making any changes at all each patch to things like game systems.

They have said a few times now that the changes based of player feedback won't be added into the 2nd stage of the beta.

If you missed the interview from SE about feedback, they have over 50,000 items of feedback so far, and those figures are a month old now. I don't think you need concern yourself about testers not telling SE what they think.

[ascalon]

Currently its slightly easier to target with a controller because you can use the d-pad to cycle to mobs to the left of you (by pressing left, surprise!) as well as right, unlike Tab which only cycles to the right. But as has been said, this will no doubt be fixed by beta.

[Jinko]

Shift tab should cycle to the left ?

[Shuichi]

Also, please alpha testers bug them for a recipe book. I don't think anyone can name a game in the last 5 years that didn't have recipes listed somewhere in game, at least after you learn them.

Its one thing to tab out for maps or strategies, but a recipe book is pretty standard at this point, like a quest log.

I have to agree here. It was a real pain having to alt-tab all the time to look up what was needed to make things in XI. Aion has a neat little recipe list of things you learned how to make. Something like that would work.

[ascalon]

Shift tab should cycle to the left ?

Aha! They've updated the official controls since I last checked them. Thankee!

[Calemero]

Given how Square came down on almost every site leaking info i'm rather sure they are looking at the popular sites.

actually they haven't even scratched the surface of the sites posted leaks. Nor will they ever.

[Jinko]

Aha! They've updated the official controls since I last checked them. Thankee!

LOL was more a question than a statement, I think even FF11 lets you back tab by pressing shift and tab tho.

+1 for recipe lists.

[ascalon]

LOL was more a question than a statement, I think even FF11 lets you back tab by pressing shift and tab tho.

+1 for recipe lists.

Hahah yet another way I've been "doing it wrong" in FFXI for so long >_< Duh! You are nevertheless quite corrrect. I even learned another couple of things about targetting by checking the controls list.

For reference:
F9 = target self
F11 = target nearby characters
F12 = target party members

[Chakra]

Using a Controller and keyboard for typing is inferior to just using the keyboard alone and I don't care what anyone says. It just is.

[Urza]

Is there an option in Alpha to remap keys?

[Adajer]

I played XI on ps2 and xbox so I used the control and never had any problems. As slow as the battle was I don't see how anyone could have problems with the UI on a controller.
I plan on playing xiv on pc and trying out keyboard first then controller.

[Adajer]

Using a Controller and keyboard for typing is inferior to just using the keyboard alone and I don't care what anyone says. It just is.

When using keyboard I assume wasd is movement, so do you have to like press enter or something first to type something in chat? I hated that in WoW. Holding a controller and having a kb in my lap worked great for me so....Guess that makes me inferior.

Nothing is liked 100% by everyone.

[Jinko]

Yes you are required to active chat mode in FF14 either by pressing space or /, this is a small price to pay for having an action bar bound to number keys.