Over 20 people walk past a stabbed hero after he stops a rape (VIDEO)

[Not Kuno]

The numb reality? Of what? That there exist people without homes that need to sleep in the middle of the sidewalk? I think we exist in clear understanding of it, it appears you don't realize that they exist, however.

[Lucavi]

Oh, you live in NYC. Nevermind. This was a waste of time.

[Not Kuno]

You're more than welcome to come to NYC, don a costume and run around saving people. Me personally, I get to work by foot. I see tons of people with problems and it is physically impossible to help all of them. I see people looking for a missing wallet/phone, someone might not have enough cash to pay for something, a couple running for a train i know they just missed. You can't help everyone dude. This isn't a big city thing, this is a 'do I want to get to work and do my part', or 'do I want to help everyone in the city with a problem like this is a fucking RPG and I'll get 300 exp points and a ring of flames'.

[liggy 0]

shit like this makes me think of the old days outside my friends liquor store in LA. Pedestrian gets hit by a car and a bunch of people mug him down to his undies. wallet, watch, pants and all. not even bystanders called for help till my friends dad came out.

[Elcura]

Well there's the difference. People that live in cities are trained to be numb by the realities of life there. More news at 11.

Glad I don't live in a city.

That's probably a good thing considering your attitude. And what a stupid generalization.

[Lucavi]

You're more than welcome to come to NYC, don a costume and run around saving people. Me personally, I get to work by foot. I see tons of people with problems and it is physically impossible to help all of them. I see people looking for a missing wallet/phone, someone might not have enough cash to pay for something, a couple running for a train i know they just missed. You can't help everyone dude. This isn't a big city thing, this is a 'do I want to get to work and do my part', or 'do I want to help everyone in the city with a problem like this is a fucking RPG and I'll get 300 exp points and a ring of flames'.

No thanks. Apparently your reality is completely different from mine. That sort of thing would happen once a month, if that, around here. If its not a possession of CDS, some child molestation, or alcohol violations, it typically didn't happen here.

Also, your RPG references are cute. I already said I'm no White Knight, but feel free to continue. Apparently the fumes from the smog and garbage of that concrete pit have gotten to you.

[Alleya]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_rate_fallacy

Know it, love it.

[Marootsoobutsu]

Absolutely no mention of the bystander effect or diffusion of responsibility, as usual. Everyone loves to get on their high horse when they hear about these stories and talk about how heartless and terrible humanity is when things like this happen. None of these people seem to realize that there is a large body of scientific research that shows in the same situation most people would do the exact same thing regardless of their 'morals'.

This is also massively sensationalized and probably contains a fair bit of bent truth, just like the Kitty Genoveese story they mention. None of the people who passed by him could have possibly known that he stopped a rape, yet the article plays this up in order to get a bigger emotional reaction from readers. Some in this thread already mentioned that in big cities you mind your own fucking business for your own good.

Believe what you want to about what you think you would do in this situation, but don't pass judgment on the character of other people when you don't have any frame of reference for the external factors weighing on them.

Here is where education is important: I am aware of the bystander effect, and as a result of my knowledge, always double-take on unusual circumstances, and take deliberate efforts to err on the side of unnecessary warnings. To my knowledge, this has saved at least two lives, so... yay.

With this in mind, I have to suspect that at least a couple of these people who walked past were aware of Kitty Genoveese; it's the same damned borough. They may not know all the details of Kitty's case and the subsequent studies and investigations, but what's important is that they *know* people tend to ignore emergencies if they aren't involved and other people are around. Perhaps (probably) not everyone, but I'd have a hard time buying *NONE* of those bystanders were aware of it.

Also, just because it is a *tendency* of people doesn't make it an *excuse*. "People are dicks" doesn't mean they aren't dicks just because people, generally, are. It is entirely possible to lament the state of humanity, while recognizing that I, too, have lamentable traits. Anyone who saw the blood was so far in the wrong for not calling 911, period.

[Alleya]

Go ahead and bother to read my other 10 or so posts in this thread lol.

[Lucavi]

Too many numbers, dammit.

[Fievel]

shit like this makes me think of the old days outside my friends liquor store in LA. Pedestrian gets hit by a car and a bunch of people mug him down to his undies. wallet, watch, pants and all. not even bystanders called for help till my friends dad came out.

That's LA for you, we had a guy die at one of the hospitals I work at just recently from a gunshot, if he would have gotten to the hospital quickly he would have had a chance to survive, but nobody would take him or pick him up or anything so he ended up having to walk. Died about 20 minutes after arriving.

According to him he walked 3 miles with his hand up trying to hitchhike but nobody would stop(thats understandable). The one that got me though was that he hailed two different cabs and they drove off because they didnt want blood in their cabs.

But like I said that's LA for you. Or any big city for that matter.

[Lucavi]

^ Everyone says that, and yet, supposedly its a generalization and is evil. What can you do?

I suppose whenever someone warns someone else about going into a part of town known for crime, I should throw out the base rate fallacy argument real quick.

Its true, but that doesn't mean that people want to necessarily hear it. Sometimes you want to know if a place has a bad rep so you can be on your guard, and not justifications for why it does.

I didn't know you were such a crusader for humanity, though, Alleya. I'll keep that in mind next time a thread like this pops up.

[Alleya]

Too many numbers, dammit.

tl;dr: Just because you hear about something repeatedly doesn't mean it happens a lot. You hear about child molestors and kidnapping by strangers all the time, but the chances that your child will be kidnapped by a stranger are so tiny as to be irrelevant in your day to day decision making. More people are killed by common flu every year than killed by hurricanes, but almost everyone will ascribe more deaths to the hurricanes. We take massively stringent measures to stop terrorism, but the likelihood you will be harmed by a terrorist is almost indistinguishable from 0. Millions of people play the lottery, but their chances of winning are the same as someone who has never bought a ticket.

You hear about the cases of people passing over the injured person on the street, but you don't hear about the thousands who stop to help.

Also I'm not a "crusader for humanity", I'm a crusader against bad logic and the catastrophic thinking engendered by a sensationalist media.

[Correction]

You hear about the cases of people passing over the injured person on the street, but you don't hear about the thousands who stop to help.

Niggaz always want credit for stuff they just supposed to do.

http://i39.tinypic.com/34iipl1.jpg

[Lucavi]

No no, I was kidding. I get it.

If I may interject, though, in my profession I -do- hear about the "thousands" who stop to help, much to my annoyance. I get calls every day of townies calling about their little Timmy doing wonderful deeds or their husband or wife or friend or neighbors that did this and that, wanting news coverage or another home-town, feel-good story, which is why I said that I understand the distinction between mainstream media and home-town media.

That has nothing to do with me, though. Regardless of how little or how much I hear about something vs. how many times it happens, the real issue for me, I'm learning through city posters in this thread, is the fact that apparently people are getting stepped on and murdered all the time in cities. A flat-out murder is big news around here, and we're no hole in the wall town, but typically its a bar fight or a fight in jail and less about flat-out murder, unless its Edgewood having their little gang turf wars.

Normally a death means little to me, as, for someone who hates many aspects of humanity, the reduction of humanity would be a good thing, or at the very least, an acceptable loss, but something about this specific incident irked me more than usual. I suppose its the callous behavior written about and shown on that video. I dislike humanity, but I respect life enough to attempt to preserve it if by my own power.

[Alleya]

So basically what you're saying is that you reject all evidence that doesn't conform to your baseless prejudice against people you have never met?

[Marootsoobutsu]

Go ahead and bother to read my other 10 or so posts in this thread lol.

I have; most are basically the same thing but in different words, or basically ignoring personal responsibility by saying, "lol you wouldn't either." Good show.

Here's a question, though: You say on the one hand that there is a ton of scientific study to say this is normal, and then you start talking base-rate fallacies, that this is an exception in the sea of counter-examples. Which is it?

Regardless the Kitty-case's specific validity, the studies that followed *were* legitimate. People in groups just wait for someone else to react first; that's the *typical*. People, on their own, tend to be more reactive; that is also the typical. People, in groups, don't respond to suspicious situations. Just because it's typical, again, does not mean it's not dickish.

[Lucavi]

A rather strong-handed description, but I suppose it is what it is. I suppose anything can be spun any way, but for the sake of brevity, I'll agree.

Edit: After thinking about it, actually that's not a fair assessment. Its nowhere near baseless. I'm sorry, it is a dick move to not help someone, especially when you've confirmed that they need help, IE. fucking blood coming out of their chest. It doesn't mean you're a dick, but it is a dick move.

[Elcura]

Am I the only one who finds the whole, "I hate humanity" thing hilarious?

[Alleya]

I have; most are basically the same thing but in different words, or basically ignoring personal responsibility by saying, "lol you wouldn't either." Good show.

Here's a question, though: You say on the one hand that there is a ton of scientific study to say this is normal, and then you start talking base-rate fallacies, that this is an exception in the sea of counter-examples. Which is it?

You must not have read very closely because I said two or three times that I don't think people passing over were free of blame, but rather generalizing their behavior to the whole of humanity is fallacious. No one who fails to act is free of blame, but you don't know why they failed to act. Being a bad person is only one possibility among countless others, yet the tendency of people responding to the news article is to leap upon the nearest high horse.

Am I the only one who finds the whole, "I hate humanity" thing hilarious?

Shut up chav, non humans don't get to comment on humanity.