LS + people who box

[Xajii]

The argument that someone who is around all the time should be allowed to have their oft-used RDM mule lot a hat over someone who cannot attend as frequently is pretty heartless.

Your main is probably fucking decked already in one way or another but you want to cockblock another human player who maybe doesn't have the opportunity to play so much as you because "it would be more useful to the LS"?

Let's be honest here, one single item no matter how good it is does not change your LS's performance. It's personal reward more than anything and the fact that people want to take it away from someone for their second character just because they play less or whatever is retarded.

You dual box whoop de fuckin doo why the hell would this mean you are better than everyone else and deserve a reward? Either you were lucky enough to have a friend give you their account or you bought one or whatever. Maybe it takes more effort to play two characters but that's your decision. As far as I'm concerned there should definitely be no "extra" reward.

If you want gear for your mule, it should be at the cost of priority for all your characters. Someone in my LS has 3 mules and a main, attends nearly everything and he is up for Ebody and Ridill on his mule, but only because he has chosen that as his priority over the span of all the characters. Even this I find a little unfair as the main character is the only one that's used 100% of the time and it alreeady has armadaberk ridill etc. But those gears were acquired elsewhere outside our LS so whatever.

tl;dr Don't be fucking selfish. Just because someone doesn't play as much as you doesn't mean they don't deserve an item. Having a mule doesn't make you cooler than everyone else.

[Aurara]

The argument that someone who is around all the time should be allowed to have their oft-used RDM mule lot a hat over someone who cannot attend as frequently is pretty heartless.

Your main is probably fucking decked already in one way or another but you want to cockblock another human player who maybe doesn't have the opportunity to play so much as you because "it would be more useful to the LS"?

Let's be honest here, one single item no matter how good it is does not change your LS's performance. It's personal reward more than anything and the fact that people want to take it away from someone for their second character just because they play less or whatever is retarded.

You dual box whoop de fuckin doo why the hell would this mean you are better than everyone else and deserve a reward? Either you were lucky enough to have a friend give you their account or you bought one or whatever. Maybe it takes more effort to play two characters but that's your decision. As far as I'm concerned there should definitely be no "extra" reward.

If you want gear for your mule, it should be at the cost of priority for all your characters. Someone in my LS has 3 mules and a main, attends nearly everything and he is up for Ebody and Ridill on his mule, but only because he has chosen that as his priority over the span of all the characters. Even this I find a little unfair as the main character is the only one that's used 100% of the time and it alreeady has armadaberk ridill etc. But those gears were acquired elsewhere outside our LS so whatever.

tl;dr Don't be fucking selfish. Just because someone doesn't play as much as you doesn't mean they don't deserve an item. Having a mule doesn't make you cooler than everyone else.

THANK YOU you said it better than i did! except for the part where the mule is up for ridill/e.body sell that shit

[Kilorilo]

Lots of people in my LS duo/tribox, they get some bonus points based how often they do it for events. imo if you have points for something, i see no reason someone shouldn't be allowed to lot something for a mule, regardless of whether non-mules need/want it.

*edit: iirc 2 shenlongs have gone to mules/alts ... lolz

[NynJa]

That is a terrible example and a person like that is a loot whore. Lotting a hugely important upgrade just so you can store it is greed straight up. That's why points systems have are flaws just like any other system.

Whys it greed? Its greed because I want to spend 50 points to give myself inv+4 over someone whos cheap and wants to try to get it for 21...or less? That's what you call greed?

I'd like to point something out:
http://www.ffxiah.com/player.php?id=5577
You have THREE jobs at 75. My MULE has more than you, you really have no idea how taxing inventory can get.

[FailureMidgard]

tl;dr Don't be fucking selfish. Just because someone doesn't play as much as you doesn't mean they don't deserve an item. Having a mule doesn't make you cooler than everyone else.

Really? 'cause basically every point system ever developed disagrees with you.

Also, what's up with the whole "if you already have it on your main" bullshit? Are you saying if someone has a rdm main and a warrior mule, it's ok for them to get an ebody, but if someone has 2 chars that are both red mage (and both used), it's hugely different to ask for 2 abodies or 2 chapeaus? Furthermore, if someone uses 1 char for their rdm, and another for warrior, and plays both as needed and wants a rdm and a warrior item, how is that any fucking different than someone who has both jobs on 1 character?

Are you people even thinking about the arguments you're shitting out at the moment? Also, for shells that care about more than dynamis (mainly camping shit), while it may be hard to 2box a melee and a mage in dynamis, on the other hand having a char in dynamis and a char in a holding party at tiamat just in case it spawns is significantly different...and if Tiamat happens to spawn during that 3hrs, oh well if you don't pay full attention to dynamis for a bit...

To the OP - there's no right answer here, obviously. It's really up to your shell. As someone who used to 2box to help out quite a bit, I personally feel that rewarding people who 2box in a useful fashion is perfectly fine (meaning they don't suck at it, use it at diff camps, or just have 2 chars that have different jobs, and they play whichever is needed as a main would switch jobs), but how really depends on what your shell wants to do - gil reward, slightly more priority on your main, or the ability to just lot shit for your mule also. It's flat out stupid though to say "well, if you don't want to 2box, don't, we're not gonna help you at all!" 'cause that just hurts the shell...

[Aurara]

Really? 'cause basically every point system ever developed disagrees with you.

Also, what's up with the whole "if you already have it on your main" bullshit? Are you saying if someone has a rdm main and a warrior mule, it's ok for them to get an ebody, but if someone has 2 chars that are both red mage (and both used), it's hugely different to ask for 2 abodies or 2 chapeaus? Furthermore, if someone uses 1 char for their rdm, and another for warrior, and plays both as needed and wants a rdm and a warrior item, how is that any fucking different than someone who has both jobs on 1 character?

It shouldnt really matter with chapeaus, as alot of shells that have been doing dynamis with should be capped/close to cap. I'd be fucking pissed if somebody who already had an item on their main was allowed to lot against me having already beaten me on it in the past.

[FailureMidgard]

It shouldnt really matter with chapeaus, as alot of shells that have been doing dynamis with should be capped/close to cap. I'd be fucking pissed if somebody who already had an item on their main was allowed to lot against me having already beaten me on it in the past.

Except you're just throwing shit out of context.

Person A 2boxes. He got a XYZ item over you 2 months ago.
Since then, you've gotten a dring, an ebody, and an abody.
Now, XYZ item drops again, and he wants it for his mule. You feel you are entitled over him, because you are a main? I'd tell you to fuck off and stop being a greedy fuckwad.

On the other hand, he shouldn't get priority on it simply because he's dual boxing. None of us arguing for the dualboxer are saying he should. But defaulting the item to you because you aren't a mule in the above scenario is stupid as hell, in my personal opinion (assuming the mule is used, properly, on that job).

[Aurara]

Except you're just throwing shit out of context.

Person A 2boxes. He got a XYZ item over you 2 months ago.
Since then, you've gotten a dring, an ebody, and an abody.
Now, XYZ item drops again, and he wants it for his mule. You feel you are entitled over him, because you are a main? I'd tell you to fuck off and stop being a greedy fuckwad.

On the other hand, he shouldn't get priority on it simply because he's dual boxing. None of us arguing for the dualboxer are saying he should. But defaulting the item to you because you aren't a mule in the above scenario is stupid as hell, in my personal opinion (assuming the mule is used, properly, on that job).

I see your point, gotcha.

[thetruepandagod]

Main character -> buyer -> mule.

[NynJa]

It shouldnt really matter with chapeaus, as alot of shells that have been doing dynamis with should be capped/close to cap. I'd be fucking pissed if somebody who already had an item on their main was allowed to lot against me having already beaten me on it in the past.

Then maybe you should conserve your points differently, or attend shit. If someone has been able to outlot you once, and then accumulate enough points to overtake you again, then you're the problem, not the person beating you.


Nowhere have I posted at all that anyone who 2boxed events should be given greater rewards, you're 2boxing because you want to 2box for whatever reason.

[6souls]

Main character -> buyer -> mule.

this, plus fuck point systems

[Baelorn]

Person A 2boxes. He got a XYZ item over you 2 months ago.
Since then, you've gotten a dring, an ebody, and an abody.
Now, XYZ item drops again, and he wants it for his mule.

This is fine. I think most people have a problem when all things are equal but Person A gets it for his mule over a main just because he 2boxes.

If that guy's mule is making or breaking events get another person to join the shell. If you were previously giving gear to a mule then an extra member obviously isn't going to change your gear distribution by much.

[Michelob]

I think the item in question also plays a large role in whether or not a mule should be able to lot it. In my linkshell, we have given things like Byakko's Haidate and Velocious Belt to a mule as well as Duelist's Chapeaus and various other rare equipment. The person that got the Haidate and Velocious belt for his mule would tank things like Tiamat and Cerberus in holding parties (while also singing songs with his BRD mule at the same time as gearing up his main to come out) as well as solo hold KV and various other HNMs for the linkshell. I haven't heard anyone complain that his mule got those things.

That being said, if that person wanted to lot something like a Black Tathlum or Ancient Torque for his mule that wouldn't have happened. Something that drastically helps the linkshell out as a whole is a lot different than lotting something that makes your mule marginally better.

However, I could see where other linkshells might have had some huge dramatic event occur over something like lotting gear for a mule so in the end it just matters how your linkshell works and if it works for you I guess.

[FailureMidgard]

This is fine. I think most people have a problem when all things are equal but Person A gets it for his mule over a main just because he 2boxes.

If that guy's mule is making or breaking events get another person to join the shell. If you were previously giving gear to a mule then an extra member obviously isn't going to change your gear distribution by much.

All things aren't equal. I have no earthly idea why that would be the assumption, and why everyone that has a problem is thinking this is the case. Nobody here is even arguing for "all things being equal". The entire point that I think people are trying to make is that if the point system being used says you can lot it for a mule, you've probably earned it for said character. The very fact that you have more points, and can lot that item means that all things are not equal.
And before you say it, a shell that doesn't use a point system does not mean all things are equal.

Attendance, following directions, and generally being useful to the shell should earn people the ability to get items. If a person actually plays their mule / will use the item, why does the fact that it's on a second character matter? I've known people who had 1 char as a mage, and 1 as a melee. They played whichever was needed. Why tell them their 2nd character can't lot shit? How is that any different from someone who has all the jobs on 1 character? In fact, it's better, because they can have a Rajas and a Tamas~

[Aurara]

Then maybe you should conserve your points differently, or attend shit. If someone has been able to outlot you once, and then accumulate enough points to overtake you again, then you're the problem, not the person beating you.


Nowhere have I posted at all that anyone who 2boxed events should be given greater rewards, you're 2boxing because you want to 2box for whatever reason.

The situation doesnt apply to me(not saying you said it did, i have all that shit and ppl in my ls arent allowed to lot gear for a mule over a buyer/other person), we have a tier system switched from points. for dyna we just comment shit, recently a MULE got a chapeau because nobody wanted it and there were no buyers present. In fact, i could have lotted it..but i wouldnt have been 5/5 so i wasnt about to dick over his mule that he uses quite a bit.

[NynJa]

I'd like to point out one more thing:
If I 2box on my own accord, I shouldnt expect any bonuses for doing it.
If you ask me to 2box for you, I then expect something extra.

[Marihoki]

Also, what's up with the whole "if you already have it on your main" bullshit? Are you saying if someone has a rdm main and a warrior mule, it's ok for them to get an ebody, but if someone has 2 chars that are both red mage (and both used), it's hugely different to ask for 2 abodies or 2 chapeaus? Furthermore, if someone uses 1 char for their rdm, and another for warrior, and plays both as needed and wants a rdm and a warrior item, how is that any fucking different than someone who has both jobs on 1 character?

I think people see getting two the of the same item as bad is because if you were to have one account, you would never be in the situation to get two of the same item. If you had one account that was a brd and one account that was a rdm, and you wanted a dalmatica for both of them, you could have just leveled brd or rdm on the same character and got just a single dalmatica. I don't know if i'm explaining myself well but I can see why people would be rablerablerableing about people getting two of the same item in that sense.

However there's absolutely no difference between having two characters with different jobs that needed different sets of gear, then having them on one character in my mind. I leveled up two characters because I wanted to be a tarutaru melee instead of a hume. My main lotting job in my Linkshell happens to be my warrior, almost everyone considered for the longest time to be my mule.... I hate this mule stigma that goes around having two characters, its rather frustrating at times.

If someone could explain to me what the difference between having two chars with two different job sets and two totally different gear sets is any different from having one character with the same jobs and the same gear, I would like to hear it. I don't really think there is much of a difference, besides the fact you get more inventory room, and you are sometimes not able to lot on something because you can't bring both characters into the same zone (like dynamis-tavnasia) when you have to many people show up to an event.

[FailureMidgard]

I think people see getting two the of the same item as bad is because if you were to have one account, you would never be in the situation to get two of the same item. If you had one account that was a brd and one account that was a rdm, and you wanted a dalmatica for both of them, you could have just leveled brd or rdm on the same character and got just a single dalmatica. I don't know if i'm explaining myself well but I can see why people would be rablerablerableing about people getting two of the same item in that sense.

However there's absolutely no difference between having two characters with different jobs that needed different sets of gear, then having them on one character in my mind. I leveled up two characters because I wanted to be a tarutaru melee instead of a hume. My main lotting job in my Linkshell happens to be my warrior, almost everyone considered for the longest time to be my mule.... I hate this mule stigma that goes around having two characters, its rather frustrating at times.

If someone could explain to me what the difference between having two chars with two different job sets and two totally different gear sets is any different from having one character with the same jobs and the same gear, I would like to hear it. I don't really think there is much of a difference, besides the fact you get more inventory room, and you are sometimes not able to lot on something because you can't bring both characters into the same zone (like dynamis-tavnasia) when you have to many people show up to an event.

I still don't see why you think getting 2 of the same item is unfair or bad though. As my previous example showed, the number of items can and should play a role in things. If someone has 2 different accounts, and all they want are 2 RDM hats, why is it inherently worse to give this to them, than to give someone else 1 RDM hat, 1 dalmatica, 1 ebody, and 2 valhalla pieces. Everyone seems to be up in arms that giving someone 2 RDM hats is far worse, but I just don't logically see how anyone can make that argument unless they are oblivious and truly think all other things are always equal - ie, the guy that wants 2 RDM hats will have the exact same attendance and wants as the guy that has an entire shopping list of shit. Yea sure, if there's 2 different people with the exact same attendance, both got an ebody, abody, and valhallax2, 1 already got a rdm hat on his main, and a 2nd drops, nobody is gonna say the guy should get a 2nd, since everything else somehow is the same. But lets be honest, that never happens, and again, it makes 0 sense whatsoever that getting a 2nd RDM hat is terrible, but giving the guy that got a rdm hat 4 other good items is A-okay.

[NynJa]

You all should realize that since myself and Failure are in accord, you all lost your entire argument.

[Aurara]

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