LS + people who box

[Aksannyi]

Most of the time, as far as I'm aware, people who were lotting for storage or alt characters would pass for someone who needed it for the first time anyway, even if they had the points. Sure, there are plenty who wouldn't, but you're acting as though everyone with an alt is a greedy shit. They're not.

[orson]

Most of the time, as far as I'm aware, people who were lotting for storage or alt characters would pass for someone who needed it for the first time anyway, even if they had the points. Sure, there are plenty who wouldn't, but you're acting as though everyone with an alt is a greedy shit. They're not.

I'm not saying that at all, though the way Nynja is going of you'd think that the case. I have no problem with people lotting stuff with the points for alts and even replacing NQs for storage under the right scenarios. Again everything is situational but the whole idea that I'm trying to get across is that if you are using a point system to provide yourself a little convenience over helping another player actually getting what they need to actually do their job better than you should seriously be examining as to why that person is slightly behind you in points. That's ultimately the difference between being greedy or a team player.

[NynJa]

Sorry Aks, but inventory and points are a cutthroat business. I'm not going to pass on a 50 point Duelist Chapeau, just to not see one drop for another 5 months, then wind up having to pay 150 points.

Bottom line though your story doesn't put you on same level as someone losing an big item through no fault of your own other than not having quite as much time to spend on a game as the guy who wants 2 of the same fucking item.

durrr

You have the exact amount of points as the guy that already has the item and you end up missing 1 dynamis due to a family emergency that sets you back 1 point.

So because someones GM call was handled by a dumbfuck GM who found it worthy to suspend me for 3 days for a search comment saying "F Kings" is clearly a fault of my own? I've GMed people who were shouting direct explitives and had stuff like "nynjas a cocksucker" in their search comments, and I was told "use blacklist, we'll deal with the search comments"...
But you're right, I'm greedy, and it was my fault.

You are a retard.

Again everything is situational but the whole idea that I'm trying to get across is that if you are using a point system to provide yourself a little convenience over helping another player actually getting what they need to actually do their job better than you should seriously be examining as to why that person is slightly behind you in points. That's ultimately the difference between being greedy or a team player.

What the fuck?
I'm greedy because I show up to boring city runs, because I show up to runs where I have nothing viable to lot to increase my point total...but McSlacker is more worthy of an item than my alt because he's too good to show up to a boring city run and feels like skipping Beaucedine because he allready has his job's AF from there? If he wanted the item that bad, he'd show up to boring city runs, and the areas where he has nothing to gain because he wants to amass points to make sure he can get his Duelist Chapeau.

The mere fact that McSlacker only shows up to runs that benefit him actually enforce the idea that he's going to get his shit and fuckeroff, meaning the Duelist Chapeau wont even be seen again.


PLEASE counter this above rebuttal, I'd LOVE to see you pull this one off, without just going "LOLURGREEDY".

[Aksannyi]

Sorry Aks, but inventory and points are a cutthroat business. I'm not going to pass on a 50 point Duelist Chapeau, just to not see one drop for another 5 months, then wind up having to pay 150 points.

And I'm not necessarily saying you shouldn't. I am of the firm belief that if you have the points, you have the lotting right. If you want to pass for someone who hasn't yet gotten it, that's on you, but I'm not one to fault someone who has the points for taking an item they've earned with said points.

I am just pointing out that there are some people who would pass if they're just lotting to store or for an alt, and so it's not always so black and white. Even Joe "I can't come all of the time but I'll give my best effort when I can" will get his drop in fair time.

[orson]

So because someones GM call was handled by a dumbfuck GM who found it worthy to suspend me for 3 days for a search comment saying "F Kings" is clearly a fault of my own? I've GMed people who were shouting direct explitives and had stuff like "nynjas a cocksucker" in their search comments, and I was told "use blacklist, we'll deal with the search comments"...
But you're right, I'm greedy, and it was my fault.

You are a retard.

I can't believe that you can't can't grasp the difference between, being a twat and putting comments out that can get you suspended and something like having to miss a few events because of an IRL emergency. It's not the same thing, people aren't going to care if you're getting suspended for doing stupid fucking things. You're not talking about getting suspended for kiting/pinning VNMs or something equally arbitrary that people have done for years and been ok doing. Quit whining like a bitch and take responsibility for your own stupidity.

What the fuck?
I'm greedy because I show up to boring city runs, because I show up to runs where I have nothing viable to lot to increase my point total...but McSlacker is more worthy of an item than my alt because he's too good to show up to a boring city run and feels like skipping Beaucedine because he allready has his job's AF from there? If he wanted the item that bad, he'd show up to boring city runs, and the areas where he has nothing to gain because he wants to amass points to make sure he can get his Duelist Chapeau.

The mere fact that McSlacker only shows up to runs that benefit him actually enforce the idea that he's going to get his shit and fuckeroff, meaning the Duelist Chapeau wont even be seen again.


PLEASE counter this above rebuttal, I'd LOVE to see you pull this one off, without just going "LOLURGREEDY".

Again you're completely misconstruing the point of what I'm saying. Everything I said is not even close to the scenario you lay out, I'm done there's no point in arguing over something that you aren't even willing to look at the other side of.

[NynJa]

You have no counterargument, you know you can say nothing to refute what I've said, so you're just falling to "you're an idiot, you're greedy". Face it.

[orson]

You have no counterargument, you know you can say nothing to refute what I've said, so you're just falling to "you're an idiot, you're greedy". Face it.

Because you haven't made a point in the last 3 posts you're just repeating the same shit that I've already responded to. It's impossible to argue when a discussion has just come to complete halt and both sides are in disagreement of how a situation should be handled. In your mind you don't perceive yourself as greedy because of wanting 2 of the same item. I suppose that's just the way you think. I'm just going to stop now because there's really no point in talking to someone who has their head so far up there ass they can't see any merit in helping their friends out over a small bonus for them self.

[NynJa]

You're greedy and stupid

[Xajii]

I believe that there are some arguments that Nynja and Failure and others are making that technically make sense and can't be refuted but it's very hard not to look at some of their opinions and decisions as inconsiderate of other players and detrimental to an overall enjoyment of the game. To call it a "cutthroat business" sounds really depressing and it seems tot ake the fun away from this game for me when people are placed in an environment like that where they feel like they *have* to fuck someone else over. I suppose it has to do with how seriously you take this game but I can say I've rarely been in a group of people where I felt like that, and I've done every endgame event ad nauseum.

Some people in the thread are also setting up faulty arguments by comparing their trials and tribulations as far as getting their mule geared to the plight of someone who "only shows up for shit they want". I don't think that's what anyone here is talking about and while those people definitely exist, there are also people who have jobs, school, etc. who might be only able to show up 75% as much as others or some figure like that. Those people deserve gear over your mules.

Also on a sidenote I wonder how many people actually leveled their second character from 01/00 to multiple 75s with missions and accesses complete and how many had them handed to them by people who quit or other underhanded measures. It seems hard to justify prioritizing the 'quit friend's account' over others to me. Again this is supposing that the person with one character isn't a brand new member or just shows up to stuff they want. That's a completely irrelevant argument.

[NynJa]

Vermy was handed down to Nicholas about 4-5 years ago, who moved to Tanker for about 5 months, to Nikelz for 1, to me....who I've had control of for about 4 years, timelining back to when I started my current (shit) job.

When I got her, she was rank 10 in Windurst, RDM 60 BRD 75, had done enough CoP for sea access, that's about it.

I lvled up her WHM BLM and SMN, all fully merited, I finished her rank 10 bastok, finished sea for her, did apoc nigh, she has bv2 access, she's got clearance for all dynamis areas, she has a medal of altana, completed all 3 expansion packs, has captain rank, has a balrahn ring, has a Runic Key...

Vermy isnt a mule...shes a secondary character, better than most peoples mains.

Kehhiko on the other hand is shit. My ex (HOLY FUCK I HAD A GIRLFRIEND BUT IM GREEDY) created her, I took over her when I broke up w/ her at like RDM 30. Now she's RDM75, halfway merited, WHM BLM sj's only, DRK's at 30...r10 bastok, just finished AU. She's something I'd classify as a mule. I'm tempted to get rid of her, except I foolishly put my Bearclaw Pinnacle nexus mule on her polid

[Cesaria]

Also on a sidenote I wonder how many people actually leveled their second character from 01/00 to multiple 75s with missions and accesses complete and how many had them handed to them by people who quit or other underhanded measures. It seems hard to justify prioritizing the 'quit friend's account' over others to me. Again this is supposing that the person with one character isn't a brand new member or just shows up to stuff they want. That's a completely irrelevant argument.

I had two alt accounts (one got hacked and because it wasn't mine originally I had naff all chance of getting it back). Both were handed to me by a friend who quit. I've not levelled jobs 0-75 on them, but I've levelled subs, finished off BST on the char I use because it was bugging me not being done etc (and it's bloody handy to have to abuse sky FoV to level subs on my main). I don't expect gear for them though - like I said, I've had rot drops from dynamis which fortunately I wanted (BST AF2). I've done work on him, but it's been for my convenience really - things like questing recalls, opening up zone accesses he didn't have, some merit abilities he was lacking that I wanted, capped his exp (he was of the school that a buffer was 4 wasted merits).

Had one moron try to argue with me for 30 minutes that I was wrong for calling the pet-elf a mule and not an alt. To me he's a mule, albeit a very useful one to have around.

[Marihoki]

Also on a sidenote I wonder how many people actually leveled their second character from 01/00 to multiple 75s with missions and accesses complete and how many had them handed to them by people who quit or other underhanded measures. It seems hard to justify prioritizing the 'quit friend's account' over others to me. Again this is supposing that the person with one character isn't a brand new member or just shows up to stuff they want. That's a completely irrelevant argument.

I myself leveled both my characters 0 ~ 75, all missions complete except 2 bastok past quests, access to almost everything, full merits >_>; I can probably think of 11 people from my server off the top of my head that have second characters that they have leveled themselves.

However those 11 people on the server compared a lot of people who have gained second accounts and can dual - box D: sometimes it seems like half my linkshell has some sort character they acquired from someone who quit. I even have a lvl 73 rng account I got from a friend a long time ago. I guess the number of people who actually leveled characters on their own is extremely small.

[Cesaria]

Inevitable considering the age of the game and number of people who've moved on really.

[Limlight]

Jesus christ this is still going on? God Orson/Nynja just give it up! Your dickslinging contest is driving me insane!

[NynJa]

Jesus christ this is still going on? God Orson/Nynja just give it up! Your dickslinging contest is driving me insane!

Dont like it, dont read it, hit the big green < at the top left of your screen.

[Odin'sLaw]

Simple way to settle this

Nynja you did something stupid (i wouldn't say it was ban able but sadly bad luck happens) so the brunt of it was you missed out on your Armlets first time round

Orson he's just fucking with you now even thow i do agree with you more in the situation, we've all had our "greedy" moments

i do believe point systems do work for dual boxers with the "items of prior" list of normally 3-5 and once you have all the items on that list you can update it since the player isn't getting double the points he can't lot the first 2 Chapies so it does seem fair but to bring this crazy topic into a bigger nose dive

what if 1 player 2 chars wanted 3 Chapies? i think thats where i'd lay down the line and start saying there greedy

[NynJa]

I love how for 6 pages it was about Chapeau, and nowhere did OP mention relation to that haha

[Araius]

I used to dualbox in my Dynamis shell. They allowed anyone to lot 2 different jobs/win 1, but they would not allow me to lot one job on each of my characters. Bummed me out, I wanted BLU hat on one character and COR hat on the other. Never suggested or assumed I would be able to win both, that's just silly. But I figured surely I could at least have the option to lot one or the other. No such luck...I ended up not going to Dynamis altogether in large part due to that.

D-boxing is hard work, and in my case (RDM and COR) it was very beneficial to the run. Seemed silly to penalize me for it. If it were my LS, I would treat 1 person dual-boxing the same way as 1 person single-boxing, and just pool their jobs essentially. But once you've won an item on 1 char, priority for your other char would be reset or what have you.

[Apelila]

You do realize half the people here are arguing you shouldn't be allowed to spend points on it, which is what some of us are arguing against...

I didn't reading the rest after this, didn't see any other direct responses. Anyone arguing that I shouldn't be able to spend my points as I see fit is within their right. However, I used/use both my characters as much as one another, in more than a few instances in the past dual boxing. I never tried to spend points outside the LS rules (spending 2x if everyone only got to lot one item and the like) and never had anyone get their panties in a knot when I did 70% of my points on WHM and spent them on a B. Haidate for my MNK.

From what I've read so far most people are opposed to someone who obtained / leveled another toon but refuses to come on any jobs that it has leveled, while wanting to gear it. I'm with them. If you have RDM leveled but refuse to play RDM but want a Chap then you don't fucking need a Chap. If you want to play MNK but are always on RDM because none of the other RDM's want to / can come / suck then you deserve it first. I see all this talk about whats good for the LS and blah blah; it's about who helps the most and isn't a gigantic douche nozzle. I never caused drama and did what needed to be done to succeed, I got to freelot WHM shit when it dropped. I also passed quite a few times due to lolwhm relic. (Except for the Briault. I wanted that thing badly).

[ringthree]

I didn't reading the rest after this, didn't see any other direct responses. Anyone arguing that I shouldn't be able to spend my points as I see fit is within their right. However, I used/use both my characters as much as one another, in more than a few instances in the past dual boxing. I never tried to spend points outside the LS rules (spending 2x if everyone only got to lot one item and the like) and never had anyone get their panties in a knot when I did 70% of my points on WHM and spent them on a B. Haidate for my MNK.

From what I've read so far most people are opposed to someone who obtained / leveled another toon but refuses to come on any jobs that it has leveled, while wanting to gear it. I'm with them. If you have RDM leveled but refuse to play RDM but want a Chap then you don't fucking need a Chap. If you want to play MNK but are always on RDM because none of the other RDM's want to / can come / suck then you deserve it first. I see all this talk about whats good for the LS and blah blah; it's about who helps the most and isn't a gigantic douche nozzle. I never caused drama and did what needed to be done to succeed, I got to freelot WHM shit when it dropped. I also passed quite a few times due to lolwhm relic. (Except for the Briault. I wanted that thing badly).

There are always rules, standards and by-laws as to how you can spend points. All LS's have different rules. Making blanket claims about "I should spend my points however I want" only works in a vacuum where real world considerations are ignored. There are very few LS's that don't have restrictions of some kind, so making the argument for a laissez-faire point systems is a non-starter for most.