Mexican teenager killed by US border official

[Correction]

I'm addressing the incident in an objective manner taking no sides. You're presenting it as if these little Mexican saints were having a picnic before the strolling American Custom Border Patrol agent randomly shot one of them in the face out of boredom. Are you just reading what you want in my posts?

I'm trying to say that

"You shouldn't throw rocks at cops because they will shoot to kill."

and

"Cops shouldn't ever use anything more than the required amount of force at all times."

Are both pieces of speculative fiction. They stand on equal rhetorical footing. When you respond to one as 'kumbaya bullshit' and say the other somehow is 'all that needs to be said,' it triggers my lie detector.

[Deadgye]

I'm not saying he should have killed her, but I understand.

http://www.babble.com/CS/blogs/strol.../chrisrock.jpg

I agree with this guy. Solely because that is my favorite stand up session.

[Kuya]

Bottom line: don't annoy armed security with loaded firearms, no matter where you are they are.

I don't care what justification you have - the security has a fucking gun, loaded with ammo. Do you know what happens when a bullet hits someone? Do you WANT to die today?

Jesus, the guy was wrong, but the kids were idiotic, and as a result, there's one less idiotic kid on this planet. A's in school be damned, you do not mess with armed security, no matter how much you THINK they'll restrain themselves in the name of "professionalism".

This is an example of humanity's foolish mob-mentality, where the size of one's balls grows larger in proportion to the amount of people around him/her, temporarily united under the same cause.

Social Darwinism. The gift that keeps on giving.

[archibaldcrane]

Wut?

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=6848672&page=1

If by safe, you mean safe for armed folks, I'd buy that. Arizona, Texas and guns and stuff.

The top four big cities in America with the lowest rates of violent crime are all in border states: San Diego, Phoenix, El Paso and Austin, according to a new FBI report. And an in-house Customs and Border Protection report shows that Border Patrol agents face far less danger than street cops in most U.S. cities.

The Customs and Border Protection study, obtained with a Freedom of Information Act request, shows 3 percent of Border Patrol agents and officers were assaulted last year, mostly when assailants threw rocks at them. That compares with 11 percent of police officers and sheriff's deputies assaulted during the same period, usually with guns or knives.

.

[Kuya]

There's something funny about an argument that puts stones on the same level as knives and guns.

Equally funny, is the lack of proportionality from the people who insist on the kid's stupidity. They put the kid's stupidity on the same level as the agent killing the kid. As if the two were equivalent! What twisted sense of reality is that?

[Xno Kappa]

I'm trying to say that

"You shouldn't throw rocks at cops because they will shoot to kill."

and

"Cops shouldn't ever use anything more than the required amount of force at all times."

Are both pieces of speculative fiction. They stand on equal rhetorical footing. When you respond to one as 'kumbaya bullshit' and say the other somehow is 'all that needs to be said,' it triggers my lie detector.

And what "lie" is that? I'll quote myself on how I feel about the matter;

Did the kid deserved to get shot? No.

Did the kid's actions helped to get him shot? Yes.

Should the officer had shot that kid? No.

Should the officer pay for his piss poor judgment? Yes.

What exactly is it about this that you disagree with? I call your stink "kumbaya bullshit" because you seem to make your assessments as if we live in a perfect world. Of course none of this shit should have happened but reality is a bitch.

[Kuya]

Of course none of this shit should have happened but reality is a bitch

What is your point?

[Xno Kappa]

My point is that the cop should be punished, but the kid was still a dumbass. What's yours?

[Kuya]

No, what is the point of the comment you made, the one that i quoted. What does "shit happens" have to do with anything that was said in this thread?

[Deadgye]

What does "shit happens" have to do with anything that was said in this thread?

What doesn't "shit happens" have to do with?

[Xno Kappa]

No, what is the point of the comment you made, the one that i quoted. What does "shit happens" have to do with anything that was said in this thread?

You mean the whole bit with half of you guys saying the cop should had exercised perfect restraint because he was obviously a model CBP agent? Yeah, shit happens.

[Kuya]

You mean the whole bit with half of you guys saying the cop should had exercised perfect restraint because he was obviously a model CBP agent? Yeah, shit happens.

I don't understand the point of your comment. People are saying that he should have exercised restraint because that is exactly what's expected of him, and when he fails to do so, there should be consequences.

Your use of 'model' and 'perfect' is ridiculous, given that those are standards that are expected of any agent, not just a perfect one. Your comment lacks context and i still fail to see what you tried to bring to the discussion with it.

[Xno Kappa]

What the hell is your point Kuya? I've already stated there should be consequences for the cop.

The fact that you're somehow insinuating there hasn't and will never be an overzealous law enforcement official and the actions of this border patrol agent somehow comes as a great shock to everyone is exactly what I said before, kumbaya bullshit.

[Kuya]

What the hell is your point Kuya? I've already stated there should be consequences for the cop.

The fact that you're somehow insinuating there hasn't and will never be an overzealous law enforcement official and the actions of this border patrol agent somehow comes as a great shock to everyone is exactly what I said before, kumbaya bullshit.

My point, again, was this comment:

Of course none of this shit should have happened but reality is a bitch

Which you then changed to this comment:

You mean the whole bit with half of you guys saying the cop should had exercised perfect restraint because he was obviously a model CBP agent? Yeah, shit happens

Is senseless. Perfect restraint and model CBP agent sounds like some obfuscating and condescending drivel. What was expected of the agent was restraint that was standard, not perfect.

I have made other points in this thread, but i specifically quoted that bit since it was out of place.

I already know that you corrected your stance when Correction criticized you, by saying that the agent should be punished. I also don't see where i'm insinuating what you're accusing me of, so you're going to have to prove that.

Though people should be outraged, if that's what you're criticizing. That this stuff happens is no reason why people should grow desentized to it, because it is outrage that keeps people sensitive to these sorts of things. Case in point, torture in Guantanamo and tasers.

[Day]

Kuya asking someone what their point is... funniest shit on BG.

[Xno Kappa]

If only the kid had a gun.

[tyven]

kuya what utopia do you live in where innocent people are not constantly pwned by the authoritative figures in their lives? idk how you can afford to always be so outraged when stuff like this is so common place. must be because you are so sexy

[Deadgye]

What was expected of the agent was restraint that was standard, not perfect.

Shit happens.

[Ziero]

Not only that but he was a fair distance from the people throwing rocks and could have gotten away.

...gotten away? Where the hell was he going to go dragging around someone he just arrested who struggled the whole time? Was he just supposed to leave the guy there and run away, which would then in turn let that guy run away?

I agree that the situation wasn't as dire as people claimed, nor do I feel the use of deadly force was absolutely needed. But the concept of the guy "getting away" from a gang of kids pelting him with rocks while trying to drag their buddy off to the slammer is ridiculous.

I don't understand the point of your comment. People are saying that he should have exercised restraint because that is exactly what's expected of him, and when he fails to do so, there should be consequences.

Your use of 'model' and 'perfect' is ridiculous, given that those are standards that are expected of any agent, not just a perfect one. Your comment lacks context and i still fail to see what you tried to bring to the discussion with it.

And the fact you seem to not believe the officer was restraining himself in that situation is laughable. The use of the words 'model' and 'perfect' are more then fitting in this situation because other then taking that one shot, the officer was showing a lot of restraint. It's not just that a bunch of kids were throwing rocks at him that was the danger, it was the fact they were doing it while he had someone in custody that was the danger. Any cop knows that just because you got some guy's wrists tie wrapped, it doesn't mean they're no longer a threat, and any outside aggressors to the situation only enhance that threat.

Like I said in my first post about this topic, this was a sucky situation for everyone involved. Did the cop need to shoot his gun? I don't believe so. Did the kid deserve to die? No, but he certainly wasn't an angel in all of this. Should the cop be thrown in jail for what happened? I don't think he should because it was a bad situation all around and he just made a bad decision on how to handle it. Though he shouldn't be a border guard no more, that's for sure.

But should I be outraged? Nope, not in the least.

[Kuya]

Can anyone who works for law enforcement answer this: What are the rules for law enforcement when danger may come to bystanders or themselves? Are they expected to pursue a suspect even if they may be putting their lives or the lives of others in danger or are they encouraged to forego capturing a suspect if it means escalating a situation where danger may come to any party?