Adjustments of the Job Persuasion! (06/17/10)

[Yugl]

Where the fuck were you all when Thorny and FM were calling SCH worthless compared to BLM and RDM?

[Narol]

To be fair, all I said there was that I didn't agree SCH should be getting t5 nukes. Giving them a bigger share of BLM's pie than WHM's (e.g. SCH doesn't get native Cure5) is a bit lopsided.

[Hookah]

To be fair, all I said there was that I didn't agree SCH should be getting t5 nukes. Giving them a bigger share of BLM's pie than WHM's (e.g. SCH doesn't get native Cure5) is a bit lopsided.

Considering we'll be able to sub c4 soon enough I seriously doubt sch won't get c5 eventually.

Who knows what SE has in store for blm down the road? If they're going to add 2 new t5's every 5 lvls blm will have them all by 90. Maybe they've got shit planned that will blow t5's away.

At least we can hope they do.

[Narol]

Aside from ga4 and possibly Comet/Meteor, SE doesn't really seem to see BLM as doing much more than bursting off skillchains. It's unlikely we'll see much in the ways of creative new abilities/traits for it.

One of the things I think would be kind of neat (even if it seems more RDM-ish) would be to give BLM a Plague spell. You know, the TP poison status. Edit: Also, since virus/plague is fire-based, it'd make Vulcan's Staff useful (Burn barely counts as a use).

[Hakurin]

To be fair, all I said there was that I didn't agree SCH should be getting t5 nukes. Giving them a bigger share of BLM's pie than WHM's (e.g. SCH doesn't get native Cure5) is a bit lopsided.

If you look at scholar's spell list, you would have noticed that SCH gain a nuke 3levels after BLM with the exception of tier4. It was pretty much a given that SCH would have access to tier 5. BLM’s feel threaten because their nuking dominance is seem less than absolute. Those who are worried about that kind of thing; should be less concerned about SCH having tier 5, and more concerned about if SCH gains tier 2 storms. As for SCH white magic spells, it is yet to be announced if and when scholar will receive Regen3. Regen is the only spell SCH gains before any other job, but Regen3 is something we may have to wait for.

As to why SCH doesn’t get Cure5 (yet):

Cure5 is one of the white magic spells that set WHM apart from other healers. With the benefit of low enmity generation SCHs would love this, but giving it to them as it is now would throw the power balance right out the window (I could see them AoE Cure5 spam from outside of a party/alliance). If you were to give Cure5 to SCH you also have to give it to RDM, it learns cure spells before SCH does. The reason why neither has them now is more to with PLD in my opinion. PLD going to need a more powerful cure by Lv99, but Cure5 is no use too them in its current state because of the enmity it generates. My guess is SE doesn’t know how to address this issue as of yet. They could add a job trait for WHM so curing generates less enmity, or adjust one of the Lv40 WHM abilities to give that effect. I know you think it’s lopsided that SCH going just into BLM territory and not WHM, but don’t forget SCH will be getting Protect5 and with that said Shell5 seems certain as well. As for Cure5 we’ll have to wait and see how SE tackles the issues around it.

[Alkar]

Are BLMs going to complain when PUP gets tier V as well? Get over it already.

[Spira]

at least you got a new JA and spells. if thats getting fucked over then jobs then idk where to begin with BRD

[Draylo]

SCH and PUP definitely wont be getting Meteor.

[Miroku_Asura]

I'm kinda surprised Sch wasn't given the beginning of tier 2 Storm spells with this patch- If they want Sch to be unique without stealing Blm's thunder (pun intended), why not give them a spell that would function the same as double weather? Also, here's hoping for eventual tier 2 Helices

[Dimmauk]

at least you got a new JA and spells. if thats getting fucked over then jobs then idk where to begin with BRD

Yeah wasnt BRD supposed to get a new JA that made songs not get overwritten on the BRD?

[Hyan]

Yeah, at some point during the road to 99.

[LD]

Why are people talking about tier 2 storm spells as the defining point of SCH when the point is to apply them to everyone who needs them? Even at 99, /SCH won't have access to all of the tier 1s. Also, sharing tier 4 nukes doesn't make BLM unique, only potentially better.

The real defining point of SCH has always been the number of Strat charges and the speed at which they recharge. Lvl 90 would be the point at which SCH should get its 5th charge and the recast should be lowered to 48 seconds. Really think about that.

[ronin sparthos]

Comet and Meteor... I can already smell the disappointment when those two spells turn out to be horribly inefficient spells that take damn well forever to cast.

People already complain that AM2 aren't worth the MP they use so what is driving this idea that Comet/Meteor (usually the most MP intensive spells in an FF game) are going to be the messiahs of the class? Not that BLM needs a messiah to begin with but yeah...

BLM has always been a simple class in its previous incarnations so I don't see a huge problem when most SCH can't directly approach BLM without having a solid understanding of the class. It isn't like any SCH can outright put BLM out of business though the class has the potential to be competitive.

Cure V? Im pretty sure SCH will be getting that through Addendum: White soon enough since they decided to open up Cure VI for WHM. What Cure VI does is unknown but as HP levels continue to rise, Cure IV isn't going to cut it. PUP gets Cure V already so precedent is there.

[Hakurin]

Why are people talking about tier 2 storm spells as the defining point of SCH when the point is to apply them to everyone who needs them? Even at 99, /SCH won't have access to all of the tier 1s. Also, sharing tier 4 nukes doesn't make BLM unique, only potentially better.

The real defining point of SCH has always been the number of Strat charges and the speed at which they recharge. Lvl 90 would be the point at which SCH should get its 5th charge and the recast should be lowered to 48 seconds. Really think about that.

Who was talking about tier 2 storms being defining sch. Someone comment on being shock they haven't started that line yet. My comment earlier was to BLMs who are crying over SCH having access to tier5 and their thinking their "dominance" is threaten. Yes there are SCHs that can out nuke BLMs same tier (being that sch is the only one with weather), but try to get over it. Everyones looking at the here and now, and forgeting there still a ton of stuff to be added later, keep in mind this is the tip of the iceberg. You're off a bit, what defines SCH is it's versatility and adaptability which arts and stratagems help them achieve.

[Miroku_Asura]

Why are people talking about tier 2 storm spells as the defining point of SCH when the point is to apply them to everyone who needs them? Even at 99, /SCH won't have access to all of the tier 1s. Also, sharing tier 4 nukes doesn't make BLM unique, only potentially better.

The real defining point of SCH has always been the number of Strat charges and the speed at which they recharge. Lvl 90 would be the point at which SCH should get its 5th charge and the recast should be lowered to 48 seconds. Really think about that.

I'm not saying its a "defining point of Sch", I'm just selfish and want double ice weather with +7 int all the time :3

On the topic of increasing charges, what do you guys think about Cor getting additional QD charges as the cap is raised? Doesn't seem too outlandish to me considering its available as a sub now.

[Hakurin]

I think it will come sooner or later. I'm still stunned that cor's weapon is Hexagun, you think there would of been a 6 shot JA or WS somewhere? Think they'll give COR 6 QD charges by 99 then at least? One can dream

[Nevex]

Where the fuck were you all when Thorny and FM were calling SCH worthless compared to BLM and RDM?

Because two people stating that SCH is useless compared to those jobs surely matters more than hundreds of SCHs successfully playing the job in a number of situations and outperforming them when it comes to MP efficiency and AoE buffing respectively.

The addition of Haste (and eventually Refresh) only makes SCH's job even easier.

[Savanah]

A fun tidbit for when we hit the 99 cap... /pup will offer cure IV for white mages as a subjob at level 96+. Essentially you get a automaton casting a hatefree (even to auto, automaton cures generate no enmity) 88 MP spell to a party member every 18 seconds or so. And done right it won't run out of MP either. Of course, considering the huge amount of possibilities before then, it might be that another sub will offer better MP conservation for white mage, but that's still a sub that offers hate free cures (just put up a light maneuver once a minute and it will handle the rest) and saves you up to 264 MP a minute.

Plus there's the bonus adorable/scare the hell out of party members with faceless puppet factor. And if you know how to do it, a way to deaggro a link if no one's touched it yet. /shrug

As for me, I'm just hoping that SE didn't mention the spells automaton's will get, and we get Cure VI/stone V with this update. thunder IV is practically a given, stone V fairly likely, cure VI for white mage bot is semi-sure, as whm bot learns up to cure V at the same level white mage does.

Nice theory... *but*! /PUP can't use maneuvers since other jobs can't equip the animator... and you need a light maneuver up to get the puppet to cure other party members =/

[Maksudyst]

Nice theory... *but*! /PUP can't use maneuvers since other jobs can't equip the animator... and you need a light maneuver up to get the puppet to cure other party members =/

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__...a/Animator.jpg

[Ramsos]

The lvl 1 animator is all jobs useable.