Wiki Update Thread, Help wanted Apply within...

[Mojo]

Be reasonable, the mousepad/t-shirt situation was clearly a conspiracy to embezzle that leftover donation money.

[Sesar]

For being the supposed best source for FFXI info, they sure suck at updating. New shit has been out for days now and there are still tumbleweeds rolling around FFXIclopedia's main page.

[Silenka]

It doesn't matter how the money was used, all that matters is it was not used in the way the wiki said it would be used.
It's very plain and simple, they took donations for something they said they were going to do, they didn't do it, they used the money for something else instead.
Therefore, they did betray the community's trust and did betray the people donating by not doing what they said they were going to do with the money.
It does not matter how the money eventually ended up being used, it was not used in the manner promised, thus all those who donated were deceived from the start. Of course there are going to be bad feelings from the community whose members placed their trust in such a popular bastion of FFXI information. It's a mark that will never be rubbed from the history of the community no matter how many mousepads or other bullshit are given away.

For the record, no I did not donate but if I had, I would have felt the same exact way.

[Mojo]

It doesn't matter how the money was used, all that matters is it was not used in the way the wiki said it would be used.
It's very plain and simple, they took donations for something they said they were going to do, they didn't do it, they used the money for something else instead.
Therefore, they did betray the community's trust and did betray the people donating by not doing what they said they were going to do with the money.
It does not matter how the money eventually ended up being used, it was not used in the manner promised, thus all those who donated were deceived from the start. Of course there are going to be bad feelings from the community whose members placed their trust in such a popular bastion of FFXI information. It's a mark that will never be rubbed from the history of the community no matter how many mousepads or other bullshit are given away.

For the record, no I did not donate but if I had, I would have felt the same exact way.

Do you even see the point that others are trying to make?

[Toxictaru]

All the content on otherwiki that I've contributed -- and that everyone else has -- is CC-BY-SA licensed. If anyone cared strongly enough about the issue, they could fork otherwiki and still have the fruits of everyone's labor without the people involved. That hasn't happened.

It wasn't at the time, they were using a different license. They started using CC-BY-SA -after- the move to Wikia. Specifically the license they were using at the time was the reason BGwiki used CC-BY-SA when it launched.

[Silenka]

Do you even see the point that others are trying to make?

Everyone has their own version of this story it looks like. All I'm saying is it seems much simpler to me.

[Mistress Stowastiq]

Nah, My reason was after sitting around for an hour or so, thought i'd do something productive with my time, so i made this thread after viewing the daunting task, to get people to start building the frame work of what would end up being the wiki page dedicated to the update on monday.

It was nothing more than a place were the Organization of the work myself and others were doing, could be well.... organized /shrug.

I took head, someone else took feet, etc. etc. Random dude working on daggers needed to know how to link the light.gif into his work so it showed up (I actually didn't know how to do this, hell i still don't)

But....I had no idea about the history, and in sense I kicked the White phosphorous and it started smoking again. Thread is sorta pointless now.

....

Well maybe not, it is educating others, hell it educated me, and that's saying something I guess.

Oh I see. I appreciate the answer. I started to sign up but then realized that maybe this wiki has different editor requirements. So I inquired here instead of filling out the registration form without checking first.

I don't feel that the thread is pointless because it is giving people a general idea about what status the wiki has. It educated me as well.
I am also curious about the wiki mentioned for XIV with Pikko but I wonder if it will be a fee based service like a portion of Alla is.

[LinktheDeme]

are people really still bitching over this? FFXI's wiki is much farther ahead in the race of getting information out to the people and BG's wiki is far behind. Not to mention since FFXI is in it's name people are more likely to go to that site over blue gartrs. It's like arguing that a bycicle is going to beat a car in a race when the car had a 100 mile start.

[Spider-Dan]

It wasn't at the time, they were using a different license.

As I recall, it was the GPL documentation license, which meant that anyone else would have been free to compile and sell everything off of the wiki if they wanted to take the time to do it (just like, say, Linux).

Specifically the license they were using at the time was the reason BGwiki used CC-BY-SA when it launched.

I seem to remember BG wiki using a different, proprietary license when it started, which would have opened up the possibility of BG's admins perpetrating something far, far worse than anything the community has seen so far: locking the wiki and charging users for access (and suing them if they tried to copy it). I also remember saying something to that effect, but I don't feel like searching for it (yet).

[Spira]

For being the supposed best source for FFXI info, they sure suck at updating. New shit has been out for days now and there are still tumbleweeds rolling around FFXIclopedia's main page.

you're free to make additions.. its not like only special people can edit stuff..
and that is kinda part of the entire idea of this thread...

I've been trying to make additions to new SMN stuff.. tho some articles were still protected yesterday cos i assume someone forgot that the update actually rolled by.

[Khamsin]

you're free to make additions.. its not like only special people can edit stuff..
and that is kinda part of the entire idea of this thread...

I've been trying to make additions to new SMN stuff.. tho some articles were still protected yesterday cos i assume someone forgot that the update actually rolled by.

Except, why would we update fraudwiki? BG is the wrong place to look for help for a competing wiki, especially given their history.

Don't worry, there's usually someone who takes all the info we've gathered and claim it for otherwiki.

[Spira]

Except, why would we update fraudwiki? BG is the wrong place to look for help for a competing wiki, especially given their history.

Don't worry, there's usually someone who takes all the info we've gathered and claim it for otherwiki.

because some people simply don't give a shit who gets the credit for something but just wish to have the information spread to the rest of the community, for the betterment of said community.

Sorry to say, BG wiki sucks big time. The majority of the people who give the 'why would we update fraudwiki?' excuse are just as apathetic about updating the BG wiki or any wiki to begin with. I don't bother using BGwiki because theres a more comprehensive wiki out there which isnt filled with placeholder articles.

If you wanna take the don't worry someone else will do it stance, thats fine but the quality of content anywhere will start to degrade quickly because others will adopt the same mentality and wait for someone to do it first.

And seriously, its not a competition. It never was and if you think it is, we already know who has won.

[Khamsin]

because some people simply don't give a shit who gets the credit for something but just wish to have the information spread to the rest of the community, for the betterment of said community.

Sorry to say, BG wiki sucks big time. The majority of the people who give the 'why would we update fraudwiki?' excuse are just as apathetic about updating the BG wiki or any wiki to begin with. I don't bother using BGwiki because theres a more comprehensive wiki out there which isnt filled with placeholder articles.

If you wanna take the don't worry someone else will do it stance, thats fine but the quality of content anywhere will start to degrade quickly because others will adopt the same mentality and wait for someone to do it first.

And seriously, its not a competition. It never was and if you think it is, we already know who has won.

BGwiki was created to make a point, and shows our disdain and mistrust for otherwiki as a result of their actions. To then come here and make a thread asking for BG to update otherwiki is just asking for trouble.

[Julian]

I remember when I actually cared to try and help, some dumbfuck admin went and reverted my updates back to his shitty wrong info. I then proceeded to own the fuck out of him with screenshots, and he still refused to believe I was right. Fuck that shit.

I've done a fair bit with updating bgwiki, and I know it's not that great, but meh. I don't really care for the whole fraud drama all that much, and I'm never ever updating otherwiki with my info again.

Also: WS's can be paralyzed, guys!

[Mizango]

I guess you just had to have been there, you guys are playing the "turn the other cheek" card a little too close to the vest. Good luck explaining it to people who don't care to get it, you're far better than I am Khamsin.

[Mizango]

I remember when I actually cared to try and help, some dumbfuck admin went and reverted my updates back to his shitty wrong info. I then proceeded to own the fuck out of him with screenshots, and he still refused to believe I was right. Fuck that shit.

I've done a fair bit with updating bgwiki, and I know it's not that great, but meh. I don't really care for the whole fraud drama all that much, and I'm never ever updating otherwiki with my info again.

See thats the bullshit that they are understanding, which is why I said you probably had to be there to know the full scope of the douchebaggery involved in that whole project.

Also: WS's can be paralyzed, guys!

Oh man that was epic.

Did you also know that Plds cant tank Dhamels? 4srs.

[Spider-Dan]

I guess you just had to have been there, you guys are playing the "turn the other cheek" card a little too close to the vest. Good luck explaining it to people who don't care to get it, you're far better than I am Khamsin.

I was there. I've quoted there several times in this thread already. There's nothing to get.

People who didn't donate are complaining about how money that they didn't contribute was used. And they are complaining because a) it was used to buy swag that was promised to donators or b) wiki did not get The Best Possible Deal on mousepads. Also some sh*t about stealing from the community and lack of attribution, when 95% of information in the community everywhere else is unattributed anyway.

Pearl Harbor it is not.

[Mojo]

See thats the bullshit that they are understanding, which is why I said you probably had to be there to know the full scope of the douchebaggery involved in that whole project.



Oh man that was epic.

Did you also know that Plds cant tank Dhamels? 4srs.

All of the posters who aren't in support of the select few BG members and their undying crusade against wiki were 'there,' so I'm not really sure what sort of an accusation that is. I remember updating Salvage maps on wiki and then immediately getting unnecessarily chewed out by an admin because I flagged the old maps in the 'wrong' way. We know first hand how retarded they were about every little thing. We we're aware of the facts surrounding the issue, we just exercise more prudence when interpreting them.

Everyone has their own version of this story it looks like. All I'm saying is it seems much simpler to me.

I would agree with this assessment. The move to wikia, for instance, has been interpreted by some as a cash grab sellout. What is often neglected with this interpretation is the donation goal was not reached and that the bandwidth consumption far exceeded the projections they had when setting that goal. Unless they had some other way of getting money, the move was inevitable, so complaints about this were never valid unless they were about not looking for an alternative (which probably would have been advertisements, which is pretty much the same thing just that wikia isn't involved.) Doesn't stop people from trying to make it seem much more sinister than it really was, however.

Either way, the point that others are trying to make is that this happened years ago and no good can come about shitting up every thread that even mentions wiki with fanatical curmudgeonry. Consider the irony in that this thread was created by someone who wanted to do something good and productive for the community and that, because he suggested using wiki, his efforts were immediately derailed and he was told to go away.

BGwiki was created to make a point, and shows our disdain and mistrust for otherwiki as a result of their actions. To then come here and make a thread asking for BG to update otherwiki is just asking for trouble.

Although this forum may have been started by a few, its userbase has grown into the thousands. Those who have made significant contributions to the FFXI knowledgebase have done it through this community because it provides a great platform for doing so. The number of users who adamantly continue wiki bashing is actually quite small. You do not speak for everyone.

[Mizango]

I guess it would have made more sense if I were directing my comment towards you? idk man, the only person I remember mentioning by name was Khamsin. My comment transcended this thread and was not directed towards anyone in it up to this point, but its cool, we can +1 in this bitch all night long.

[Mojo]

I guess you just had to have been there, you guys are playing the "turn the other cheek" card a little too close to the vest.

How does this not imply direction?