Abyssea Discussion

**Kegsay** · 2010-07-25 08:12

Is there a guide, even a quick-and-dirty one, to light management and effective XP?

Here goes:

The core to EXP PTs in Abyssea revolve around the hidden EXP chain. Every kill of the same family of monsters results in an improvement of 0.5~1 EXP. The aim is to kill so many monsters that you can get 600 EXP/kill. This requires certain things:

Time
The most important one. You can't possibly kill the required number of monsters in 90 minutes, you need around 3 hours. Time Extensions (TEs) come from top tier Blue chests. As stated by SE, the frequency and tier of blue chests can be improved by obtaining Azure Light. This is obtained via spell kills including but not limited to: Black(incl. Drain)/White/Blue(incl. Physical) magic.

EXP Cap Up
You will find that you will cap out your 'chain' at around 300EXP/kill unless you get Golden/Ebon light, which raises the EXP floor slowly to a hardcap of 600EXP/kill. These two lights are obtained only via higher tier Red Chests. You do not need the highest tier to get Golden, but you do for Ebon. According to SE, Golden light 'The adventurer will gain experience at an increased rate.' and Ebon Light 'A small bonus will be granted to all colored light effects.'. Red chests are obtained via Physical Weaponskill kills, which grant Ruby light.

Light Specifics
Upon killing a monster, you will receive a message: Player emits a <strength> <color> light! The strength is not an indicator of your total obtained light! The strength is merely by how much that light has increased. It is hypothesised that feeble=1, faint=2 and so on. On average, you need ~30 Azure lights to reach 'top tier' blue chests. Since TEs can only be obtained via top tier blue chests, Azure light is usually the first light people try to cap out on.

Exceptions
Some monsters do not behave in the noticed way which is:
Azure = Spell kill
Ruby = Physical WS kill
Amber = Magical WS kill
Pearl = Melee hit kill
For example, Pachypodiums do not grant ruby light when you do a WS kill. It is currently unknown if this can change or if it's a bug (read: the light does increase but no message).

Tips for a good Abyssea run
A lot of the following is subjective. Too many people fall under the wrong assumption that only pearl light increases chest frequency. THIS IS UNTRUE. To quote SE:

Azure Light : Blue pyxides will appear [b]with greater frequency[/b and yield superior spoils.

Pearl light increases the frequency of ALL types of boxes (though does nothing for improving the tier). Good Abyssea PTs tend to:
1. Cap out on Azure Light tier (~30 spell kills)
2. After cap, go all out, no holding back, mages try to snipe kill.

I cannot stress enough how important it is like so many people have mentioned to kill fast. This usually cannot be done unless you just go all out and zerg, as melee will hold back on WSes and/ore mages hold back on spells because they have been told to "try for melee hit kill shots". This usually means your kill speed drops quite severely in some cases (since WSes/spells do huge chunks of damage). A good rule of thumb is if the monster is alive for more than 30 seconds, you are killing too slowly (read: with 18 people). At that point, if you are going all out, then you should probably change some members to more DD-heavy jobs.

Chests and Keys
Most people now have around 25k+ cruor, and it is strongly advised that the designated chest opener has a lot (40+) of Forbidden Keys. Anecdotally, I have noticed better quality chests when we are just spamming keys on everything; perhaps because we are cycling through chests that much faster.

Misc Notes
Target monsters which are easy to kill/squishy, like bats/mandies/birds/frogs. Do look out for the chest opener when they are opening chests, as abilities/spell cast on them can be very annoying with Event Skipped. From the debug info I have gathered, the game can store up to 1000 kills of a specific light type when it comes to probability of chests. Therefore, even though you cap out tier at 30 azure kills, you will potentially NEVER cap your blue chest probability ratio, so Azure kills are still pretty important. That being said, once you reach 30, you shouldn't still hold back for specific colour lights in my opinion, you should be zerging and the mage snipes will get azure light enough to keep up the frequency. As I pointed out before, there is no such thing as chest drought, so do not worry about # of people in the zone.

Super condensed form
1 - Get 30 azure lights to cap tier (spell kills)
2 - Go all out, mages try to snipe kill.
3 - If you are taking more than 30 seconds per monster (with 18 people), you're killing too slowly.
4 - Cross your fingers and hope for luck.

**Kegsay** · 2010-07-25 08:17

Originally Posted by Thorny

Your goal is to gain at least 15-20 pearlescent and azure lights without gaining ruby or amber lights. Pearlescent increase overall chest droprate, azure increase chance of it being blue as well as quality of blue chests.

[...]

Also worth noting, avatar blood pacts all seem to produce 100% pearlescent if used as killshot. Positive they produce pearlescent, not positive it's 100%, but saw a good 15 in a row without noticing any not.

True to his reputation, most of what Thorny says is spot on. I would personally focus on a 'just get them dead' strategy after capping azure, but that is usually up to the individual leaders. Avatar BPs do indeed give Pearl, even Zantetsuken kills give pearl. I would say that some lights are not 100% on some monsters (you noted pearl, I note ruby on pachys), so there does seem to be some variation there.

**Thorny** · 2010-07-25 08:25

Originally Posted by Kegsay

True to his reputation, most of what Thorny says is spot on. I would personally focus on a 'just get them dead' strategy after capping azure, but that is usually up to the individual leaders. Avatar BPs do indeed give Pearl, even Zantetsuken kills give pearl. I would say that some lights are not 100% on some monsters (you noted pearl, I note ruby on pachys), so there does seem to be some variation there.

pachys dont drop ruby at all, any ruby you get at that camp is from chests

haven't seen pearl be 100% on anything though, and ruby/amber are either 0% or 100%

still a good thing to note though, you'll cap exp much slower on anything that doesn't produce ruby

**Onorgul** · 2010-07-25 08:39

For what it's worth, I watched a Summoner kill several bugards with Nether Blast last night and only some of them resulted in pearlescent light, so I'm guessing that it is less than 100%. I was pulling, though, so heaven knows I could've missed something while focused on other things.

Otherwise, thanks. This basically reiterates what I'd mostly known, but trying to cobble together all the little bits and pieces was giving me a headache.

**Zadimortis** · 2010-07-25 09:13

Originally Posted by Onorgul

Otherwise, thanks. This basically reiterates what I'd mostly known, but trying to cobble together all the little bits and pieces was giving me a headache.

My thoughts exactly. Thanks Kegsay~

**Sho** · 2010-07-25 09:39

Super condensed form
1 - Get 30 azure lights to cap tier (spell kills)
2 - Go all out, mages try to snipe kill.
3 - If you are taking more than 30 seconds per monster (with 18 people), you're killing too slowly.

4 - Cross your fingers and hope for luck.

I would throw in "5 - Kick people who don't listen to commands on killing for lights." It really could be that one/two/three people that feel they need to WS at the end of the mobs life every time that messes up a run. At the very least, in a PUG group, your melee army is expendable if they aren't obedient with when and when not to WS.

**NynJa** · 2010-07-25 11:03

Originally Posted by Sho

I would throw in "5 - Kick people who don't listen to commands on killing for lights." It really could be that one/two/three people that feel they need to WS at the end of the mobs life every time that messes up a run. At the very least, in a PUG group, your melee army is expendable if they aren't obedient with when and when not to WS.

This is such a huge problem -.- A couple runs ago I think I top tiered every light of mine, my war was CAPPED (merits xp everything), but I didnt want to leave since every kill of mine netted a top tier chest. I was constantly telling people to fuck off with the killshots, yet people still opted to be "HURR DURR EPEEN KILLSHOT"...Eventually I told the group I was going to bed since it was becoming a waste of time. If I can load up on T3/4 pop items despite the fact I'm not getting xp, I'm ok with that. If I'm wasting xp and people are being morons not letting our group get pop items, F them.

btw, mandies dont load up amber either.

Perhaps we should compile a list of what mobs load which lights?

**Byrthnoth** · 2010-07-25 11:50

Originally Posted by NynJa

Perhaps we should compile a list of what mobs load which lights?

I would be interested seeing people try to do this. My hypothesis is that certain monster families reward variable lights based on how many times they have been killed in a particular way recently. People asked in the past: "Oh hey, do Bog Bodies and Adamantoises give Amber lights?" And the answer was yes, because no retards try to xp on Qutrubs and Turtles, therefore their potential isn't "used up."

For instance, I was in an XP alliance on Blood bats maybe two days after this alliance-xp phenomenon started. We had no trouble forcing Ruby/Azure/Perle lights. Yesterday I got over 50 merits at the same exact Blood Bat camp and we were entirely unable to force Ruby lights. The other lights weren't a 100% conversion ratio.

Blood Bats (time 1): Ruby, Azure, Perle, (Amber untested)
Blood Bats (time 2): Azure, Perle (No Ruby/Amber)
Mandies: Azure, Perle, (No Ruby/Amber)
Shadow Lizards: Azure, Perle, and Ruby (All <50% rates, and Amber untested)

I distinctly remember thinking to myself when I partied on mandies after bats, "Oh man, why are these retards partying on Mandies if you can't force Ruby light here? They should move over to bats!"

Can elseanyone confirm getting a light regularly on one trip and not on the next?

**NynJa** · 2010-07-25 11:54

If any 'potential' is used up, how come Azure and Pearl lights load with ease? Surely if there were any cap, Azure and Pearl would cap out just as rapidly. Not to mention the recent maintenance SHOULD have reset any potential caps, yet on day one I couldnt load Ruby nor Amber lights.

**Dathus** · 2010-07-25 12:32

So the lights are based on those who get the killshots, or those who most recently joined the alliance? Like for Azures? I only ask 'cause we keep getting terrible luck on time.

**Onorgul** · 2010-07-25 12:32

May be giving SE too much credit here, but they may have made it so that you can't get screwed with Azure and Pearlescent since they are critical to actually staying in the zone. Ruby and Amber are your reward boxes, not your longevity ones.

**Kegsay** · 2010-07-25 12:58

Can someone who has completed all quests in La Theine see if it's just an 8k cruor reward or if the final Scarlet abyssite is from it.

**Cymmina** · 2010-07-25 13:07

Originally Posted by Onorgul

May be giving SE too much credit here, but they may have made it so that you can't get screwed with Azure and Pearlescent since they are critical to actually staying in the zone. Ruby and Amber are your reward boxes, not your longevity ones.

Pearlescent isn't critical to staying in the zone. My frogs group was in the zone 6 1/2+ hours with 60+ minutes leftover and we never *tried* for pearlescent. We got it by accident and from red chests. We had plenty of chests up all the time (1 dedicated chest opener, the 2nd BRD helped with chests between songs; if there were enough chests up, BLMs also worked on chests between sleepgas).

Red boxes are for increasing your lights, something you want if you have people coming and going to spend their merits.

**cdgreg** · 2010-07-25 16:06

Tried random Q thread without any luck, take #2:

1.) How does Artemis Medal drop work with Cannered Noz? Is it like Ix'Drk where it won't drop treasure until it's done RR'ing? Or can it drop treasure on any death?

2.) How many stuns should you have for Ashtaerth the Gallvexed (Pedant Cape NM)?

Thanks

**miokomioko** · 2010-07-25 16:16

Can anyone confirm whether or not the effects of Viridian/Scarlet/Azure Abyssites of the same type all stack no matter which zone you're in, or if they only function in their appropriate zone.

Viridian = Tahrongi
Scarlet = La Theine
Azure = Konschtat

It would be interesting if all 3 ___ Abyssite of Merit stacked when you got HP boost.

Also, how much does an Abyssite of Merit affect the HP/MP boosts?

**Kegsay** · 2010-07-25 17:20

Figured I'd post my debug findings for the curious ones:

Spoiler: show

**miokomioko** · 2010-07-25 17:32

This is interesting and might explain people hitting 610 on Bugards as the small/large ones most likely have different IDs. Perhaps you cap out on same-family-chain, then move to roaming around and pulling from different families to cap it out at like 1000exp/kill.

INTERESTING

**Yugl** · 2010-07-25 17:34

Kegsay, it's true that only pearl increases the frequency of chests. The other lights only manipulate which chest spawns. When I led my last Abyssea alliance, I made it a goal to cap azure (Six guesses) and subsequently focus on pearl. As the run continued, we would go back to azure kills whenever a TE was needed or new member arrived. This kept us running for over 14hrs and appears to be the winning formula. Your quote does not discredit the use of pearl light to increase chest frequency. Once people cap out pearl light, it's quite obvious because you'll see a chest from nearly every kill. Think of SE's description once more and you'll see that it probably works on a two roll system. When a mob is defeated, a roll determines whether that monster will drop a chest or no chest. Pearl should increase the chance that a chest will drop. Afterward, second roll determines what type of chest. This is where Azure, Ruby, and Amber come into effect. I will agree, however, that there is a ratio in place and that an overall cap is nonexistent.

More easily understood, I argue that the following functions are in place:

Kill a mob >> Chest or No Chest? [Determined by Pearl level]

If Chest, what color? >> Blue, Red, or Gold? [Determined by the ratio between Azure, Ruby, and Gold]

Blue, Red, or Gold Chest>> What tier? [Determined by the level of Azure, Red, or Gold]

You're also the first post I've seen to report a 1000 kills cap. This is important since determining the cap on the ratio between lights (If one exists at all, and if so, how?) affects when you go after specific lights.

I'm curious as to whether groups that have specifically farmed for gold always received a big box or had a mix of the two. In my last run, it's easily assumed that all of my lights were capped after 14hrs. More specifically, all of my kills yielded either a large gold box, time, or some red box (Never paid attention to which). Granted, this could have been luck since kills from an RDM without gear is rare. At the same time, it might be worth looking into whether the tier of chests increase beyond visible indicators (Namely, the number of guesses needed to open the box).

Edit: Post written before other post appeared.

**miokomioko** · 2010-07-25 17:40

The frequency at which Pearlescent raises all chest appearances by is far far far more drastic than any of the individual colored chest frequency increases.

It makes me wonder if Azure/Ruby/Amber really do increase their individual appearance rates at all, or someone screwed that up in the interview.

**Fiarlia** · 2010-07-25 17:46

Originally Posted by Yugl

Kegsay, it's true that only pearl increases the frequency of chests. The other lights only manipulate which chest spawns. When I led my last Abyssea alliance, I made it a goal to cap azure (Six guesses) and subsequently focus on pearl. As the run continued, we would go back to azure kills whenever a TE was needed or new member arrived. This kept us running for over 14hrs and appears to be the winning formula. Your quote does not discredit the use of pearl light to increase chest frequency. Once people cap out pearl light, it's quite obvious because you'll see a chest from nearly every kill. Think of SE's description once more and you'll see that it probably works on a two roll system. When a mob is defeated, a roll determines whether that monster will drop a chest or no chest. Pearl should increase the chance that a chest will drop. Afterward, second roll determines what type of chest. This is where Azure, Ruby, and Amber come into effect. I will agree, however, that there is a ratio in place and that an overall cap is nonexistent.

More easily understood, I argue that the following functions are in place:

Kill a mob >> Chest or No Chest? [Determined by Pearl level]

If Chest, what color? >> Blue, Red, or Gold? [Determined by the ratio between Azure, Ruby, and Gold]

Blue, Red, or Gold Chest>> What tier? [Determined by the level of Azure, Red, or Gold]

You're also the first post I've seen to report a 1000 kills cap. This is important since determining the cap on the ratio between lights (If one exists at all, and if so, how?) affects when you go after specific lights.

I'm curious as to whether groups that have specifically farmed for gold always received a big box or had a mix of the two. In my last run, it's easily assumed that all of my lights were capped after 14hrs. More specifically, all of my kills yielded either a large gold box, time, or some red box (Never paid attention to which). Granted, this could have been luck since kills from an RDM without gear is rare. At the same time, it might be worth looking into whether the tier of chests increase beyond visible indicators (Namely, the number of guesses needed to open the box).

Edit: Post written before other post appeared.

The ratio idea would also explain why groups that cap Azure, get TE's, and then leave Azure alone completely tend to stop getting more TE's, lending more credibility to the idea of cycling lights that some people have suggested.

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