Old Traits and Abilities Leveld up

[orson]

What about Nin/Cor would it be a worth while DD sub?

[Onorgul]

I doubt it, Orson. Warrior is pretty much the top-notch DD sub and Ninja has no reason to use anything else.

[Spider-Dan]

This is probably a stupid question, but with how random SE's coding can be sometimes, would a Coffinmaker use its unlocked DMG rating?

Yes, though the best bullets NIN can equip are D55 (so with unlocked Coffinmaker, D95), though Innin should work on Quick Draw. THF is fortunate enough to be able to equip Culverin+Cannon shells.

I think this just opened up a lot of soloable potential for every job that can use a gun ;o

Yes, all three of them (unless you're counting COR).

To be fair, it technically opens up solo potential for every job that can equip marksmanship (so RNG, THF, NIN, DRK, WAR). And with the new ammo update, Grand Crossbow+fusion bolts is D95 just like NIN's Coffinmaker+irons.

[cassiraa]

Reason to level THF to 80 found.

To elaborate: I think that could be an interesting gameplay adaptation for THF. Basically playing it as a support hybrid. Unless I'm mistaken, you get to put 1 roll on mages and 1 roll on melee, so Evoker's refresh and chaos [3-10%, so still useful subbed] If you have a COR main, you can toss Healer's roll and thief or fighter rolls to supplement. You get 3 1-min job abilities to juggle, Culverin+1 Quick Draw, Sneak Attack, and Trick Attack, and toss a few melee rounds inbetween for some TP with a OAT Magian dagger.

It would play drastically different and it wouldn't top any damage charts, but it might be an interesting way to give your Treasure Hunter THF more alliance versatility.

[Spider-Dan]

I doubt it, Orson. Warrior is pretty much the top-notch DD sub and Ninja has no reason to use anything else.

I will say this: SE has done a very good job of diversifying SJs in this update.

/SAM has basically obsoleted /WAR for RNG (and unless Fencer works with ranged attacks/WS, this is probably going to be permanent). DW3 vs. Aggressor is going to be interesting, and I think even /DNC is underrated (you can use a free Box Step before WS anytime you have >110 TP, and use it as a kind of Sublimation-for-TP with Reverse Flourish).

[Shadida]

Yeah, this is pretty cool stuff. I'll admit I wasn't even thinking THF/COR earlier, but the fact that THF does get Culverin makes this pretty exciting.

Wait, FFXI is exciting? When did that happen?

[Villian]

Silly question but why /sam obsoletes /war? Sekka really make that much of a different?

[Spider-Dan]

It's a combination of Sekkanoki, Double Shot, Conserve TP, and the ability to defend oneself when all of those things work in your favor at once.

[Villian]

I see. Sadly 3rd eye never love me so I'll still be going /nin to Ixion, /sam for other stuff like SW and VNM I guess.

[cassiraa]

Wait, FFXI is exciting? When did that happen?

me:

"I wonder how much Magic Attack bonus THF can get"

2 seconds later

"oh god... Did I seriously just say that unironically?"

[Onorgul]

I will say this: SE has done a very good job of diversifying SJs in this update.

/SAM has basically obsoleted /WAR for RNG (and unless Fencer works with ranged attacks/WS, this is probably going to be permanent). DW3 vs. Aggressor is going to be interesting, and I think even /DNC is underrated (you can use a free Box Step before WS anytime you have >110 TP, and use it as a kind of Sublimation-for-TP with Reverse Flourish).

I like Dancer as a sub, especially since it frees up a little bit of strain on Accuracy, but its lackluster defensive capability (Curing Waltz II only helps a little when SE tunes mobs to hit for several hundred damage a pop) and time-and-TP-dependent debuffs leave it sitting as a third-stringer in my mind. Dual Wield III versus Aggressor is oversimplifying. It's Dual Wield III versus Aggressor, Berserk, and Double Attack.

Your point is valid but, at the end of the day, if a job wants to maximize its damage, /Warrior is probably the way to go. Ranger/Samurai is one of the limited exceptions, though I'll freely admit that I love the combination and don't feel the slightest bit hampered by losing Berserk for it. As a utility support job, Samurai is to melee what Scholar is to mages.

As for Ninja, I'm seriously at a loss to think of anything better than /Warrior. /Dragoon would probably be the runner up, though Dark Knight brings a pile of Attack and Souleater with it, so it might be a close call between them.

[Shenrien]

I hate DNC sub, it gimps damage way to much for it it be benefit, I can't even break 1k Jin or Gekko when I sub that, it hurts you way to much, I will add tho it is a very useful sub job for the proper situations, usually the ones where you're alone and don't have anyone else to help you out with something cause its like 5am and you don't want to wait until people are up lol.

[Shadida]

me:

"I wonder how much Magic Attack bonus THF can get"

2 seconds later

"oh god... Did I seriously just say that unironically?"

Ugh I did the same thing LOL

[Atoreis]

I hate DNC sub, it gimps damage way to much for it it be benefit, I can't even break 1k Jin or Gekko when I sub that, it hurts you way to much, I will add tho it is a very useful sub job for the proper situations, usually the ones where you're alone and don't have anyone else to help you out with something cause its like 5am and you don't want to wait until people are up lol.

How is /dnc affect your max Gekko anyway??
Unleess you are fghting something very deffensive or that few str from /war make your gekko jump from 990 to 1005 or maybe you dont have brutal earring?

[boo]

Maybe he uses soboro when /dnc and other GKT when not /dnc
IDK, just guessing

[Tortalius]

/dnc has the acc bonus trait as well, so you can always drop 10 acc from your gear and get something more interesting, like a flame ring vs a sniper or something.

[Spider-Dan]

I like Dancer as a sub, especially since it frees up a little bit of strain on Accuracy, but its lackluster defensive capability (Curing Waltz II only helps a little when SE tunes mobs to hit for several hundred damage a pop) and time-and-TP-dependent debuffs leave it sitting as a third-stringer in my mind.

FWIW, /DNC's defensive capabilities are a lot better than /WAR's (which effectively has negative defensive capability). And like I said, I see /DNC's debuffs as more of a partial TP recovery for when you overshoot TP on a WS.

Dual Wield III versus Aggressor is oversimplifying. It's Dual Wield III versus Aggressor, Berserk, and Double Attack.

Specifically, I meant "the increase from DW2 -> DW3" vs. "adding Aggressor". We already know about DW2 vs. Berserk/2A.

[Khajit]

I've kinda been wondering about /drg for nin tbh since my last few parses a few months ago had atk buffs doing almost nothing for me. Zerk was the only one that changed things for some reason while chaos/warcry/dia only added about 10~50 damage a jin on average and even less to melee hits. Da becomes a slightly lower factor once the OAT or 2~3 katana comes into play as well. I obviously have to try and control any actual testing of how much atk buffs are helping me before i make any giant leaps into a new sj though.

[requim]

"I wonder how much Magic Attack bonus THF can get"

2 seconds later

"oh god... Did I seriously just say that unironically?"

Looks like thief could push 30 MAB on a 140(141) base damage weapon, so you could get ~366 in your normal TP gear and if you added HQ stave, 421 or with double weather and day obi you could get as high as 569, which is pretty amusing.

At the very least you could expect 300+ damage from an unresisted QD coupled with whatever rolls you decide to use at the cost of DWII and an offhand weapon. Depending on accuracy of QD, it might actually be the best offensive sub along with a party buff.

Anyone happen to know what the expected slugshot damage would be compared to SB/DE/EV? Might get some more use out of that occasionally attacks 2-3 times dagger lol

[Onorgul]

Anyone happen to know what the expected slugshot damage would be compared to SB/DE/EV? Might get some more use out of that occasionally attacks 2-3 times dagger lol

With Thief Marksmanship, I don't think it'd be reasonable to use Slug Shot. Even with a lot of Ranged Accuracy gear and Sushi, low skill and the inherent inaccuracy of Slug Shot (to say nothing of having to spend a fortune on Cannon Shells if you're going for a maxed Quick Draw) are going to make it highly unreliable on even merit-level targets.