New Job Abilities/Traits/Spells Data

[Tahona]

only 70 at the moment but yeah that works too.

[LilWhmMan]

Probably because they forgot they were wearing one of these?

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/8...earpendant.png


I did notice it activating a lot more since the update, however.

Nah, they were WSing in Bushi/STR Earring, maybe it was just lag or something.

[Xanthe]

You could also put a merit into Empathy, which allows you to use Spirit Link at wyvern 100% HP so you can transfer buffs.

Also with Spirit Jump, does it have some continuing effect? I initially thought when i read it that you would use Spirit Jump and then all your further actions would have surpressed enmity, but I dont know how to test it and Ive never seen any "ENmity Supression Effect Wears..." etc. Doing Magian trials i swear Ive seen situations in which i would pull a mob with Spirit Jump.... then my Wyvern would end up tanking till 50%~ or so, but this is likely me just wanting to see it.

It's only for Spirit Jump itself, nothing else.

As for the change to Spirit Link, I'm loving it. Makes misses so much less painful with these WS trials.

[Khajit]

I've been getting random 5 hit setups thanks to conserve tp or close to it on my drg. I have the shitty aern lance though since i was planning to magian trial for drg and never got around to it. I may have to create an alternate 5 hit setup for whenever conserve tp procs.

[Kirschy]

Calculating magic damage: dINT multiplier

2.31 multiplier is fucking fail. 2.33 (not 7/3) is better; 2.32 is too low and 2.4 too high. The multiplier is between 2.32 and 7/3.

Examples with Water V on Ebony Pudding (89 INT, 25% magic damage bonus):

52 MAB, 81+37 INT, Neptune's Staff

7/3: 1627 (observed)
2.33: 1627
2.32: 1627
2.31: 1626 (fail, remove from consideration)

62 MAB, 81+38 INT, Neptune's Staff
7/3: 1742 (fail, remove from consideration)
2.33: 1741 (observed)
2.32: 1741 (observed)

62 MAB, 81+45 INT, Neptune's Staff
2.33: 1778 (observed)
2.32: 1777 (fail, remove from consideration)

70 MAB, 81+33 INT, Neptune's Staff
2.33: 1798 (observed)

I've also checked Water V damage with Zodiac Ring (+0.03 to the day/weather bonus) on a certain type of elemental with either 75 or 76 INT:

75 INT:

62 MAB, 81+35 INT, Neptune's Staff, Sorcerer's Tonban, Watersday effect
2.33: 1657 (observed)
2.31: 1654 (fail)

76 INT:

62 MAB, 81+30 INT, Neptune's Staff, Sorcerer's Tonban, Watersday effect, Zodiac Ring
2.33: 1670 (observed)
2.31: 1665 (fail)

While I'm sure you know more about magic damage than I do, the limited testing I did showed 2.31 as the multiplier. I'll list a few examples I did.

Spell: Water V
MAB: 80 BLM(1.32 MAB)
Mobs: Bunnies outside Sandy(6 INT)

86 INT - 1139 damage
91 INT - 1155 damage
104 INT - 1194 damage

Working backwards, that gives us:

80 dINT - 863 Base
85 dINT - 875 Base
98 dINT - 905 Base

This works out perfectly for a base of 679 /w a 2.31 multiplier:

679 + floor(80*2.31) = 863 * 1.32 = 1,139 damage
679 + floor(85*2.31) = 875 * 1.32 = 1,155 damage
679 + floor(98*2.31) = 905 * 1.32 = 1,194 damage

I tested with more values, but only chose three for this post.

Going over your values, I do see that the 2.31 multiplier doesn't work. But your 2.32-2.33 multiplier doesn't work for my base examples. Since both of our examples use the base value I derived from a 2.31 multiplier it's possible the base value is wrong which would require a new multiplier. Is it also possible that there's an order of operations/flooring that's incorrect when using Staff + MAB + Pudding Bonus?

[CDF]

Low-level mobs are not a valid test subject unless you know the critical point for dINT (> 0) after which the multiplier is cut in half for the spell you are using (that's the putative idea, anyway). The critical point is of practically zero interest for high-tier direct-damage magic and is unlikely to be obtained for high-level mobs with non-trivial INT.

[Kirschy]

Low-level mobs are not a valid test subject unless you know the critical point for dINT (> 0) after which the multiplier is cut in half for the spell you are using (that's the putative idea, anyway). The critical point is of practically zero interest for high-tier direct-damage magic and is unlikely to be obtained for high-level mobs with non-trivial INT.

I'm pretti sure the inflection point is much higher. Also even if the inflection point was reached, it would make the multiplier half as effective, but this is showing the same trend of growth for all the values of dINT (73-98 in my tests) that I chose. My BLM isn't 80 yet, but when I get a chance later today, I'll re-run T5 tests on a higher level mob leaving out mob bonus/staff to reduce error~

[Zeb]

Anyone doing testing on despoil?
I've tried it out a bit on various mob families, and no luck so far.

I haven't had a successful despoil since the last emergency maintenance. Although I haven't done that that many. Like 0/15 tries or so, all on the same type of mob(funguar). Before that it was only magic def down that always lasts 90 seconds that only proc'ed when you successfully steal something.

[CDF]

I'm pretti sure the inflection point is much higher. Also even if the inflection point was reached, it would make the multiplier half as effective, but this is showing the same trend of growth for all the values of dINT (73-98 in my tests) that I chose. My BLM isn't 80 yet, but when I get a chance later today, I'll re-run T5 tests on a higher level mob leaving out mob bonus/staff to reduce error~

I see that a pat answer will be annoying to come by (if one exists). You're right that if a critical point exists, it should be much higher, but it is poorly characterized in my view.

If you look at this set of observations (JP), your 98 dINT observation (1194) is close to that for 100 dINT from that source (1199 with Water V, MAB +32, no other bonus). I was able to replicate some of your observations. I suppose observations will have to be obtained across a range of dINT to get a sense of what is actually going on.

[Malacite]

Shared timers are lame, -4.8% damage taken by pets is really fucking lame.


Was hoping CC would become a beast.

[Nightfyre]

More info on Spirit Jump. Enmity suppression seems to mean zero enmity or close to it. Won't even pull hate off of Dia.

http://woozers.files.wordpress.com/2...2_20090622.jpg

So much for my awesome third jump Thanks for the info.

[Psion]

Shared timers are lame, -4.8% damage taken by pets is really fucking lame.


Was hoping CC would become a beast.

At least your fucking CC has like 5k hp and a large amount of defense to go with it. Our automatons only have the standard level + vit/2 for defense and maybe another 30 from armor plates if we're lucky. I'm not joking when I say a critical hit from proto-ultima does over 900 damage, one shotting magebot. 5% physical damage down won't even come close to rectifying that.

[CDF]

I see that a pat answer will be annoying to come by (if one exists). You're right that if a critical point exists, it should be much higher, but it is poorly characterized in my view.

If you look at this set of observations (JP), your 98 dINT observation (1194) is close to that for 100 dINT from that source (1199 with Water V, MAB +32, no other bonus). I was able to replicate some of your observations. I suppose observations will have to be obtained across a range of dINT to get a sense of what is actually going on.

Determining the dINT multiplier (M) and "base damage" (D) for Stone V and Water V

I checked "naked" (no gear, no merits, no food, only 32 MAB) Water V damage on some 6-INT mobs and got the following results (note that the dINT = 130 and dINT = 140 observations are the same as that from the JP source):

dINT     Damage
129      1288
130      1290
131      1294
132      1297
133      1300
134      1304
135      1306
136      1309
137      1312
138      1316
139      1318
140      1321
141      1325

Using my personal observations, I can treat this as an optimization problem where the (sums of the absolute) difference(s) between the observed and calculated values should be 0, but know already what values of M, D for Stone V, and D for Water V give very close results (2.3, 625, and 679).

From optimization, I get D = 626 for Stone V, D = 680 for Water V, and M = 2.298605. M = 2.3 is too high but M = 2.299 gives exact calculations (based on my own observations, at least), so I would go with the following D and M values:

D for Stone V: 626
D for Water V: 680
M for tier V spells: 2.299

[Phraust]

Determining the dINT multiplier (M) and "base damage" (D) for Stone V and Water V

I checked "naked" (no gear, no merits, no food, only 32 MAB) Water V damage on some 6-INT mobs and got the following results (note that the dINT = 130 and dINT = 140 observations are the same as that from the JP source):

dINT     Damage
129      1288
130      1290
131      1294
132      1297
133      1300
134      1304
135      1306
136      1309
137      1312
138      1316
139      1318
140      1321
141      1325

Using my personal observations, I can treat this as an optimization problem where the (sums of the absolute) difference(s) between the observed and calculated values should be 0, but know already what values of M, D for Stone V, and D for Water V give very close results (2.3, 625, and 679).

From optimization, I get D = 626 for Stone V, D = 680 for Water V, and M = 2.298605. M = 2.3 is too high but M = 2.299 gives exact calculations (based on my own observations, at least), so I would go with the following D and M values:

D for Stone V: 626
D for Water V: 680
M for tier V spells: 2.299

Using this stuff you think you could project a decent idea of what the next few spells will be doing in terms of damage? (Roughly)

[CDF]

Using this stuff you think you could project a decent idea of what the next few spells will be doing in terms of damage? (Roughly)

Looking at tier IV, D increased by 29, 30, 32, 34, and 35 from Stone IV (D 381) to Thunder IV (D 541). If you think tier V D will increase by at least 54 for each spell, then you would predict conservatively (to the extent that extrapolation is actually "conservative") the following D for the rest of the tier V spells:

Aero V: 734
Fire V: 788
Blizzard V: 842
Thunder V: 896

[Kirschy]

Determining the dINT multiplier (M) and "base damage" (D) for Stone V and Water V

I checked "naked" (no gear, no merits, no food, only 32 MAB) Water V damage on some 6-INT mobs and got the following results (note that the dINT = 130 and dINT = 140 observations are the same as that from the JP source):

dINT     Damage
129      1288
130      1290
131      1294
132      1297
133      1300
134      1304
135      1306
136      1309
137      1312
138      1316
139      1318
140      1321
141      1325

Using my personal observations, I can treat this as an optimization problem where the (sums of the absolute) difference(s) between the observed and calculated values should be 0, but know already what values of M, D for Stone V, and D for Water V give very close results (2.3, 625, and 679).

From optimization, I get D = 626 for Stone V, D = 680 for Water V, and M = 2.298605. M = 2.3 is too high but M = 2.299 gives exact calculations (based on my own observations, at least), so I would go with the following D and M values:

D for Stone V: 626
D for Water V: 680
M for tier V spells: 2.299

Thanks for doing the additional testing... Seems like that works out well for all the testing. I wonder why they chose such an obscure multiplier =/

[Kalisa]

Carry on, I'm retarded, didn't find anything new. Sorry to clutter, feel free to delete.

[urat]

Well at 77 dancer Im only get a 10~15% bonus to my light/dark skillchains, do we get an upgrade at level 80, though on the other hand now that I think about it I was eyeballing it on fomors who mayve been resisting the skillchains, I should go do some actual testing on some birds or something.

30% bonus sounds fucking sexy, I was wondering if you'd be willing to test for me for sure whether or not climactic flourish forces a crit on non-critting weaponskills, as Im getting conflicting answers.

Just need to simply build up more than 1 finish, climactic flourish and shark bite and see if you get 1 or 2 crits afterwards, prolly smart to test 2-3 times to verify you didnt have a normal crit instead of a climactic flourish crit.

I'd appreciate it a lot :D

[Kalisa]

Well at 77 dancer Im only get a 10~15% bonus to my light/dark skillchains, do we get an upgrade at level 80, though on the other hand now that I think about it I was eyeballing it on fomors who mayve been resisting the skillchains, I should go do some actual testing on some birds or something.

30% bonus sounds fucking sexy

No, I was being silly and forgetting that level 2 SCs are a base 60% of damage of the final WS instead of 50%.

I was wondering if you'd be willing to test for me for sure whether or not climactic flourish forces a crit on non-critting weaponskills, as Im getting conflicting answers.

Just need to simply build up more than 1 finish, climactic flourish and shark bite and see if you get 1 or 2 crits afterwards, prolly smart to test 2-3 times to verify you didnt have a normal crit instead of a climactic flourish crit.

I'd appreciate it a lot :D

I'd test this if I knew what my max noncrit damage was, but I suck at FFXI math. If someone can tell me (mainhanding 25dmg Azoth, offhanding 18dmg Athame, working on EP mobs for magian trials) I will gladly test and see if I get any WSes above that number.

[Ayr]

Shared timers are lame, -4.8% damage taken by pets is really fucking lame.


Was hoping CC would become a beast.

Well it is a big difference if you factor in -10% from MKE helmet, -2% from neck, -3% magic dmg from belt, -8% from Magian Axe (16% if dualwield) and then add on Askar Legs and Beast Bazubands for further pet defense.