F'IN Lasers how do they work?

[Takedown3]

So i hear radio commercials that say they use lasers to cure smoking. how the FUCK does that work.

wondering if you still get the side effects of quitting using other methods like cold turkey, or patches. over-eating and the like.

[Atreides]

Chantix > all

[BerenTebogo]

Did you hear that there is this weight loss pill that lets you eat all you want and STILL lose weight?

[Qalbert]

allegedly works in a similar manner to acupuncture. in actuality is overpriced bs

[BerenTebogo]

...works...acupuncture

Acupuncture and works.

Two words that should only ever be paired in a sentence if "does not" is included.

[Qalbert]

I worded it poorly perhaps, should have used another 'alleged' to clarify. I meant it is supposed to work in the same way acupuncture is supposed to work.

[guartz]

define works,

since old asian men will disagree regarding it working at making big money.

[Souj]

Laser cuts off your head. You no longer have the urge to smoke.
Seems like a guaranteed way to kick the habit.

[BerenTebogo]

define works,

since old asian men will disagree regarding it working at making big money.

True enough.

[Klutz]

I'm very curious to see how that would actually work.

[BerenTebogo]

I'm very curious to see how that would actually work.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s_the_joke.jpg

[ZarakiKujata]

Acupuncture and works.

Two words that should only ever be paired in a sentence if "does not" is included.

Plenty of peer reviewed studies that would disagree with you on that...

[BerenTebogo]

Plenty of peer reviewed studies that would disagree with you on that...

Feel free to source them, lol.

inc arXiv.

[BerenTebogo]

Also:
http://apps.who.int/medicinedocs/en/...26e/#Js4926e.5
Acupuncture: Review and Analysis of Reports on Controlled Clinical Trials

Analysis of some hundreds of case studies of Acupuncture. Brought to you courtesy of the World Health Organization.

You'll also notice that something published like this:
10. Yu SZ et al. Clinical observation of 162 cases of acute bacillary dysentery treated by acupuncture. World Journal of Acupuncture-Moxibustion, 1992, 2(3):13-14.

Gets to call itself a peer-reviewed journal article. Boy, I bet they're fair and balanced!

Big edit: Sorry, upon re-reading it looks like I was posting this link as a rebuttal to Acupuncture. Not my intention. I posted because it's the most comprised source of journal articles I could find on acupuncture and some 90% of them are from journals I wouldn't wipe my ass with.

Sorry for ambiguity.

[Zoolander]

Also:
http://apps.who.int/medicinedocs/en/...26e/#Js4926e.5
Acupuncture: Review and Analysis of Reports on Controlled Clinical Trials

Analysis of some hundreds of case studies of Acupuncture. Brought to you courtesy of the World Health Organization.

You'll also notice that something published like this:
10. Yu SZ et al. Clinical observation of 162 cases of acute bacillary dysentery treated by acupuncture. World Journal of Acupuncture-Moxibustion, 1992, 2(3):13-14.

Gets to call itself a peer-reviewed journal article. Boy, I bet they're fair and balanced!

Big edit: Sorry, upon re-reading it looks like I was posting this link as a rebuttal to Acupuncture. Not my intention. I posted because it's the most comprised source of journal articles I could find on acupuncture and some 90% of them are from journals I wouldn't wipe my ass with.

Sorry for ambiguity.

You just don't understand eastern medicine. If its thousands of years old then its good enough for me!

[BerenTebogo]

You just don't understand eastern medicine. If its thousands of years old then its good enough for me!

My love for you is like a truck.

Also, a good and very thorough look at a journal study that proves acupunctures effectiveness! (It's equally as effective as placebo!) That was spun to appear (by the news as well) as a journal proving acupuncture.

http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/20...nterpreted.php

[Kaisha]

Placebo is a hell of a drug.

[ZarakiKujata]

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstr...71.430451.BEv1
http://www.anesthesiaanalgesia.com/c...106/2/602.full

better peer reviewed journals? There is a lot of work thats been done w/ conventional pain management and acupuncture, its not entirely crazy holistic nonsense.

Also the WHO link you posted has a list of ailments/diseases/problems which in some cases a few clinical controlled study have proven it's usefulness in, and judging Sec 1.7 of their general considerations if the studies seem to adhere to those guidelines who cares where they come from?

edit: And before this digresses into the usual multiple page nonsense, I'm not defending all eastern medicine wholesale, nor all practicers of acupuncture, but simply making a generalization about the whole practice when there have been good studies (and plenty of shit ones) that show there could be something there, means more real studies are needed to find out what works/doesn't and for the uses where it has been found useful more study is needed to shed the stigma it currently has because of its association to faith healing nonsense.

[BerenTebogo]

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstr...71.430451.BEv1
http://www.anesthesiaanalgesia.com/c...106/2/602.full

better peer reviewed journals? There is a lot of work thats been done w/ conventional pain management and acupuncture, its not entirely crazy holistic nonsense.

Also the WHO link you posted has a list of ailments/diseases/problems which a clinical controlled study that's proven, and judging Sec 1.7 of their general considerations if the studies seem to adhere to those guidelines who cares where they come from?

Anyone who wants to have a respectable opinion? There's a few key reasons why those studies weren't published in international journals (hint: it isn't the language barrier)

One of your articles cites experimentation on rabbits as the validity of acupuncture.

The second is an exercise is in not specifying any of your uncontrollable variables, or baseline statistics, and generally just being a bad scientist. Not to mention it is from the BMJ, the journal famous for happily publishing anti-vaccination studies with little to no valid testing whatsoever.

Was this supposed to be proof?

Edit: I'm glad you edited your post in support of the WHO study, because now, I can post this:

A review of the WHO meta-analysis, by the Medical Director of the British Medical Acupuncture Society, and Editor of Acupuncture in Medicine (one would assume he's an acupuncture proponent).
http://www.medicinescomplete.com/jou...0803a02t02.htm

It is clear that this report is highly biased in favour of acupuncture; indeed, this commentator had the opportunity to hear a presentation from the author in April 2003. At that presentation, Dr Zhang said that the paper was written: ‘… to show acupuncture works.’ As such, this unsystematic review cannot be used to support the contention that acupuncture is efficacious; however, it may still have some value in terms of hypothesis generation, and in detailing a large number of trials from the Chinese literature. While the latter are likely to be of low methodological quality, they probably represent the best evidence available from a hitherto rather inaccessible portion of the literature.

He doesn't believe the WHO report is reliable, and he's an acupuncturist.

Bah, broken links, I'll take that out.

[BerenTebogo]

Re your edit:

The only valid studies regarding acupuncture have shown it to work at a psychological level, not physiological. A psychological effect that is equal to, if not less than in some cases, than placebo. Because placebo is, of course, a psychological effect.

It works in the same way the placebo works. Not because the placebo helps you, but because you want it to.