Fantasy Football 2010: The leagues...Inquire inside for league openings

[Moss]

Reaching a little, yeah. QB thinks the man outside has a clear route when he doesn't (or just checks down out of habit and brain farts), intelligent receiver steps out to kill the clock to give the team another shot. Receiver makes up for a mistake by the QB.

I think I know what you are saying, but a receiver doesn't deserve any points for catching a short pass and running out of bounds for 0 yards. If you tried to reward every "smart" play in fantasy the system would be beyond fucked up.

What's not reaching, is setting up the defense. It's critical. Even screen passes for a loss of 2-3 can be beneficial to the offense the next play, or in a similar scenario later in the game.

That's a huge part of the fucking game man. This shit is chess, not checkers.

If you are losing yards on purpose to set up other plays, urdoinitwrong. Yeah, a screen for a loss might help you some way later in the game, but how and why is that supposed to show up in fantasy?

The patronizing comment at the end is great, thanks.

[Gadritan]

Cop out. Come up with a real reason.

Your turn.

Spoiler: show

What's not reaching, is setting up the defense. It's critical. Even screen passes for a loss of 2-3 can be beneficial to the offense the next play, or in a similar scenario later in the game.

Tell me this is wrong.

[Plow]

Yeah, that 8 yard run meant jack shit when the opponent got the ball on their 2 instead of their 10.

0 yard catches > field position, duh.

[Plow]

Your turn.



Tell me this is wrong.

a negative 2 yard rush sets up a play action the next drive, guess we better give that rb a point

[Akiyama]

eh? you mean running it up the middle for 8 yards and being forced to punt? if so, wouldn't you be assuming too much that the punter would pin them down that far? or am I reading what you wrote incorrectly? I probably am. It's late.

[Gadritan]

If you are losing yards on purpose to set up other plays, urdoinitwrong.

What kind of cop out is that? Is there a time when you DO try to lose yards to set up a play? Fucking no. Is the receiver the only person responsible if you lose yards? Fucking no. Don't even try that route. (See wut I did thar?)

Yeah, a screen for a loss might help you some way later in the game, but how and why is that supposed to show up in fantasy?

As a motherfucking point for the motherfucking reception. That's what we're talking about here right?

The patronizing comment at the end is great, thanks.

That was a Denzel quote, not a patronizing comment.

[Moss]

everytime you catch the ball, you have a chance of good to touchdown yardage if the blocking is there. If you don't catch it, there is no chance

So you deserve points for a failed chance?

In context of the game, it was useless, so it shouldn't be rewarded. Lets scrap all junk time scoring too.

In the 3rd and 13 hypothetical you are gaining better field position.

As for garbage time scoring-WHOAH! Watch out for that slippery slope!

[Plow]

No need to be a shit.

All I'm saying is, Bernard Berrian. You were there.

[Plow]

eh? you mean running it up the middle for 8 yards and being forced to punt? if so, wouldn't you be assuming too much that the punter would pin them down that far? or am I reading what you wrote incorrectly? I probably am. It's late.

Ok, so they get the ball on their 20 instead of their 28... it still matters, just not as much.


More than a 0 yard pass, though.

[Akiyama]

All I'm saying is, Bernard Berrian. You were there.

Haha. Fuck that guy. Nah, fuck Sidney Rice for getting good.

And yeah, of course, but shit's situational, and Fantasy isn't meant to delve into the 'what-ifs' of football. Not everyone will love PPR leagues, and not everyone will love Standards. Just wish we could have avoided this shit this year.

[Gadritan]

Just wish we could have avoided this shit this year.

Riiiiiiiiiiight. This conversation will probably happen about 9-10x before the season starts.

[Moss]

What kind of cop out is that? Is there a time when you DO try to lose yards to set up a play? Fucking no. Is the receiver the only person responsible if you lose yards? Fucking no. Don't even try that route. (See wut I did thar?)

What the fuck? You JUST SAID "Even screen passes for a loss of 2-3 can be beneficial to the offense the next play, or in a similar scenario later in the game. " I just reread both of our posts and see this turning into semantics. Bottom line is a shitty play(by the RB or WR) doesn't deserve any points. If you have coaches in your fantasy league then give him a point for the play-calling.

As a motherfucking point for the motherfucking reception. That's what we're talking about here right?

So you are telling me that a screen pass for a loss or no gain, that has some unforeseen consequences later in the game, deserves a reward for that RB who made an easy catch, and didn't do shit with it? And he deserves that point because hey, the play set up the defense later in the game.

That was a Denzel quote, not a patronizing comment.

Well it came off as "You don't know shit about the inner workings of football brah!" If you didn't mean it that way, I apologize. Because I do indeed know shit about the inner workings of football, brah.

[Gadritan]

I just reread both of our posts and see this turning into semantics.

Basically yeahno.

Explain to me how a 0 yard catch deserves any reward.

Reward? That's debatable. But.

You said this:

The context of the game is all that should matter. A 0 yard catch does nothing for you in a game, and therefore should do nothing for you in fantasy football.

Then you say:

...So you are telling me that a screen pass for a loss or no gain, that has some unforeseen consequences later in the game...the play set up the defense later in the game.

Then it just makes it seem silly when you say something like this:

I do indeed know shit about the inner workings of football, brah.

I think you're stuck on if it deserves a point or not. Don't like PPR, don't play PPR.

You said it does nothing for you in game, which made my head splode, because it can do quite a bit for you in game for the reasons I stated. It's part of the strategy etc. When I applied your logic (about the context of the game) to PPR, you started looking for ways around it.

[Moss]

You said it does nothing for you in game, which made my head splode, because it can do quite a bit for you in game for the reasons I stated. It's part of the strategy etc. When I applied your logic (about the context of the game) to PPR, you started looking for ways around it.

This is the way I look at it: There is NO play a coach calls with the goal of gaining zero yards. The receiver couldn't make a move on anyone, couldn't break enough tackles, whatever. When you talk about a play setting up other plays later in the game, you are leaving the realm of fantasy football. We are talking about coaching now, which has no place in fantasy. If your goal is to gain yards, and you fail at this goal, you don't deserve a "hey, well at least you tried!" point.

And since you know so much about football, you should know that plays for a loss or no gain aren't very good for setting up the defense. They don't need to cheat next time, their defense was already good enough for whatever play, whether it be a screen or covering a back out of the backfield.

Please enlighten me on the use of the 0 yard catch, and the amazing things it does for you in a game. Before you say "it saves the QB!" throwing the ball away accomplishes the same thing. If you are going to say, "It keeps the clock running!" they shouldn't be throwing, and if they are, that is a very specific and uncommon situation.

[Fistandantilus]

I want in on the Money league too.

These arguments are ridiculous. Tyr's scoring system was great, but I like adding the .1 for RB per carry just to reward higher carry numbers since it is becoming more rare. Other than that people are just being overly picky, this is wayyyyyyyyy better scoring than stupid ESPN or other "standard" ways.

[Dense]

Tyche, I want in. You doing auction draft? You doing money league?

[Tyche]

$20 buy in. No auction draft, regular ole' snake. 6/12

tyche
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[Chun Liroy]

Get me in prz /

[Tyche]

Ok, 7/12 with Leroy. I'm going to ask recuperi as well, he'll play I'm sure. Akiyama, you wanting in? Once we get 12/12, I'll make a due date for the entry fee for those 12, and if people don't pay up, I'll make it first to pay gets he spots.

Input as far as payout? I'm thinking $180 for the playoff winner, $40 for the runner up, and the points leader gets $20

[volcanicweather]

Sorry I'm late to the party in regards to my scoring system, but here's an explanation as there's more logic to it than Tyche is giving it.

Here's the entire scoring system:

Spoiler: show

http://trappedfan.com/wp-content/upl.../ffscoring.png

First off, Aki, I didn't just mash numbers in... I calculated the average number of yards per each position and that's how I got my numbers. I used to work in market research so I'm pretty well-versed in statistical analysis.

Passing:The point of the passing scoring system is to reward the good quarterbacks and punish the bad ones. How many offense in the NFL are successful with a crappy QB? Not many. It should be the same in fantasy. If your completion % is high your team -usually- will put up some points (there are some exceptions). Also the INT penalty is fairly steep so it helps to penalize some accurate guys who make big mistakes... turnovers kill teams in real life and they should in fantasy as well. People have scored 50+ points with their QBs before, other more than -10. Jamarcus average -3 ppg last year.

Rushing:To what others have alluded to, running for 2 yards per carry isn't helping your team and you shouldn't be given a bonus for it... so for anything under 2ypc you lose points and anything over you gain points. I also scaled the rushing yards by position because WRs especially are known for having a stupidly high ypc thanks to reverses and trick plays.

Receiving:I used to have a yards per catch system but I scraped it in favor of a minuscule ppc system. To add value to TEs they get 1 points for every 3 catches whereas RB/WR gets 1 point for every 4. TEs also get 1 point for every 7 yards gained, WR/RB it's 1 point for every 8.

Kicking:I fucking hate kickers and fantasy and think they are so random, but I've finally figured out a decent way to score them. Essentially the longer the field goal, the more points your kicker receives for kicking it and the less the penalty he has for missing it. If he a kicks a 55 yard FG and makes it., he gets 5.5 points. If he misses, he only loses 0.5 points. On the other hand, if he makes a 25 yard FG, he only gets 2.5 points and if he misses it's -3.5 points. XPs are worthless imo and are only .25 points. Kicking 4 XP shouldn't hold the same value as scoring a passing TD, that's just retarded.

Defense:The average number of offensive points allowed in the NFL per game as of 2009 is around 20. So I give each defense 19 points when they start the game and for each offensive point they allow they lose a point. They can gain points via sacks, turnovers, etc but like QBs it really separates the good defenses from the bad ones and places a high value on having a decent defense, just like in real football.

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Here were the top 10 scorers in my league last year (points per game):

1. Chris Johnson - 30.7 ppg
2. Drew Brees - 23.2
3. Ray Rice - 22.8
4. Adrian Peterson - 22.3
5. MJD - 22.1
6. Aaron Rodgers - 21.8
7. Peyton Manning - 21
8. Frank Gore - 20.9
9. Matt Schaub - 19.9
10. Phillip Rivers - 19.7

A fairly accurate list of the top NFL players last year if you ask me... highest WR is Andre Johnson (17th), TE is Dallas Clark (29) and DEF is NYJ (34).