FFXIV Random Speculation/Question thread VI: Phase 3, FFXIV is still on the rag!

[Battlecat]

Only bad news I saw was the lack of AH really.

Endgame doesn't matter when they're gonna raise the level cap in 3-4 months anyway. They could go the route where everything you work towards is completely useless every time they release an update. But that'd be more tragic than any of the other problems the game has imo. Just makes me wonder why I'm playing the game in the first place.

It's SE, a company known for it's storytelling. If you think the little storyline you got in beta is indicative of the rest of the game, I have feeling you're mistaken. SE doesn't like giving up plot points before release, that's nothing new.

Mouse users can eat a dick. Partially b/c i hate using the mouse for anything that I don't have to (FPS and RTS essentially) and even went 1-50 or 60 in WoW before my friends forced me to start using a mouse. And then Partially because I got sick of reading through the 300 pages of people with a mouse crutch that can't seem to quit repeating the words "hardware mouse" over and over like a horde of zombies hunting for brains. Also, I'm a spiteful S.O.B.

I have faith that the laggy UI issues will get fixed soon enough and that the Retainer system will see a big overhaul, not by release though, maybe around the time of the first level cap increase. I figure if you go play cataclysm for the 2-4 months that will take for that game to get boring again, and then hop on XIV you'll probably be pretty happy with the results.

[Elcura]

This.

It is really starting to piss me off that when someone says "Maybe they planned it to be that way", they are automatically "SDF". Or better yet, when someone goes on a page-long rant about one part of the game which is agreeably awful, they say "inb4 SE Def Force, hurr".

It reminds me of politics, where there is no middle ground. Only extreme sides that refuse to acknowledge there is merit outside of their own opinion.

I can understand why people are frustrated, but I think some people are getting kinda... enthusiastic with it.

Personally, I'm not expecting much at retail, how could I be with a lot of the negativity (and I'm English, so low expectations are a given). But I'll still give it a shot, and then make up my mind about it. I'm not going to base my actions on anything other than the retail.

[Aeolus]

This.

It is really starting to piss me off that when someone says "Maybe they planned it to be that way", they are automatically "SDF". Or better yet, when someone goes on a page-long rant about one part of the game which is agreeably awful, they say "inb4 SE Def Force, hurr".

It reminds me of politics, where there is no middle ground. Only extreme sides that refuse to acknowledge there is merit outside of their own opinion.

This is the truest things anyone's said in the last 40 or so pages of ranting. Way to go Shadowcatt!

[Kirb]

People are overreacting a little, I think. It might just be the vaguely obnoxious I'm-so-jaded nature of BG mixed with a little mass hysteria, but who knows. I'm keeping my preorder, if they don't patch shit up within the first month or two, I'll stop until they do. What I got from the interview was:

'We're gonna fully finish implementing all the stuff that should have been in the release within the first couple updates.'

It's a shame, but I know how rough it can be to be in a studio with a tight deadline, so I can't say I'm not sympathetic. The only part where I actually frowned in the interview was the AH statement, because I think that should be fixed for the release, not an update, no matter how fast it comes.

To those who are complaining about it being a shell of a game after X amount of years, a dev team size is not static. In all likelihood, the team was probably very small, for conceptualizing work, until last year. It doesn't excuse the end product, but it explains it, at least.

But anyway, I'm actually going to like, you know, play the retail game before making my decision.


Edit: and rereading the interview, it certainly makes sense. Who should they be catering content to first? The casuals, not the BG crowd. That's the money-maker, in the beginning. It sucks, but I can't blame them.

[Ghostsix.Midgard]

It was mentioned in an interview that there WERE vendor-sold armour and weapons in cities in the Gamescon build, however, so maybe it won't be SOOO bad.

What/why are all the goddamn crafting classes gonna craft when people are buying shit from the vendors and spamming leves for gear? Who's gonna bother manually clicking thru 9999 bazaars when they can just say fuck it and hit up a vendor?

inc rolanberry fields right outside the clusterfuck of the marketwards.

It's safe to say surplus is here to stay. They just admitted they have no endgame content. They NEED to keep people from reaching the cap.

Mind BLOWN.
PROFOUND SADNESS =/

The games been in development since '06? I think that was when we first saw that screenshot of Rapture. My question is, what the fuck have they been doing, besides closing themselves off to how the genre has evolved of course?

Making the game look pretty, of course.
They really should ship the game with a gamepad if they aren't gonna give kb players custom keybinds.

[mastamind]

^ I admit it, I loled.

On-topic, though, has anyone found any higher level shields than the level 7 barnyard plank shield? Assholes in the ward selling that mess for 10k because its the only thing around.

Someone was strutting around with a kite shield in P2 from a faction leve, so they're probably hiding more of the goodies up there.

there's a lvl 13 shield but you need buffalo leather and i cant find a leatherworker.

http://ffxiv.zam.com/en/item.html?ffxivitem=4100004

there's also a lvl 17 one, i'll see if i can get it to show up later

http://ffxiv.zam.com/en/item.html?ffxivitem=4100602

[Cichy]

I dont know about other people playing beta but this is how currently my gameplay is looking:
1. I log on get leaves and do about 8 leaves on conjurer in maybe an hour.
2. I switch to miner and go mining till I hit surplus which is hour or two.
3. Log out for two days till leaves and surplus reset.

My biggest fear, especially after today interview is that this is how my gameplay will look when the game comes out.
I do plan to lvl a craft and I abondoned that in beta because I dint wanna burn out before retail version. I'm not really worried about endgame content not being available right away but I do hope there will be more things to do than 10 min guildleves. The surplus thing is the most frustrating thing I think I ran into in any game. If you enjoy lvling 1 job why would you be penalized for it? Pisses me of that SE is going to fuck even with what we want to lvl and when.

[Kirb]

I'm still not convinced that surplus is some kind of anti-grinding method, since the surplus seems to be just that, a 'surplus' with the points filling a rank of its own, presumably to be used somehow.

I'm actually kind of wondering why the interviewer didn't insist on questioning what the hell surplus was to be used for.

[Lucavi]

I'm still not convinced that surplus is some kind of anti-grinding method, since the surplus seems to be just that, a 'surplus' with the points filling a rank of its own, presumably to be used somehow.

I'm actually kind of wondering why the interviewer didn't insist on questioning what the hell surplus was to be used for.

Would be nice if it was for a merit-esque system. Give Lancers a meritable jump and hoo boy...

[Nama]

Kinda worries me people complain about the "8" market wards. If you check out the wards theres a Next button in the list. Theres actually 20 market wards........
Hard to find anything in 8 wards god forbid if more then that manage to become full.

[Cichy]

Yes, there is about 20 market wards and the thing that would help a ton I think would be if there was a number which would indicate how many retainers are in each ward.

[Baha]

This.

It is really starting to piss me off that when someone says "Maybe they planned it to be that way", they are automatically "SDF". Or better yet, when someone goes on a page-long rant about one part of the game which is agreeably awful, they say "inb4 SE Def Force, hurr".

It reminds me of politics, where there is no middle ground. Only extreme sides that refuse to acknowledge there is merit outside of their own opinion.

People half-joke about that defensive shit because even legitimate concerns get bombed with it.
Mouse control terrible? "FFXI was fine without it! SE knows what they're doing!"
Crafting system is unintuitive, clunky and needs a recipe book? "They're doing it to stop bots/control the economy/make crafting more of an accomplishment". Oh, and insert a stab at Wow.

It's something that happens often with online game beta's though. APB also had a very vocal part of the beta community that loved the game to bits. Sadly, the game had huge and legitimate issues, but complaints about them by more critical testers got flamed and minimalised. The critical testers (rightly) proclaimed that the game couldn't go to retail in the state it was in, yet it did (not solely due to the supportive testers of course), where it failed pretty spectacularly.

Supportive testers will respond to flaws by saying that they're unique or different, even if they're that just for the sake of being unique or different. Failing that, they'll act like any proper MMO-addict would and say to hold out for the next patch (hell, people are even calling for the next expansion here). The patch that will fix EVERYTHING. As we all know, those patches do not exist in MMO's. Especially with SE's track record (see the 2h update or really, a lot of issues).

Like you said, both extreme negativity and extreme positivity are very annoying to read. I'm really hoping it'll turn out well, but SE has been slacking in updates, and especially in communication. Yet I have to say, I'm seeing a lot more people respond, even to justified, non-ranty criticism with SE's own "Working as intended!". That's really not helping anyone.

Yes, there is about 20 market wards and the thing that would help a ton I think would be if there was a number which would indicate how many retainers are in each ward.

Personally I think some clearer names would help too. Fripper's Ward? wat. One ward for each of the gathering and crafting classes, and a few miscellaneous ones for crystals, armour, weapons, accessories, popitems, repairs etcetc. Needs a search/comment function as well, and probably more, but I really don't see the point in those impractical names over practical ones.

[dmnthia]

What/why are all the goddamn crafting classes gonna craft when people are buying shit from the vendors and spamming leves for gear?

This made me lol until I realised you were serious.

[ascalon]

What/why are all the goddamn crafting classes gonna craft when people are buying shit from the vendors and spamming leves for gear? Who's gonna bother manually clicking thru 9999 bazaars when they can just say fuck it and hit up a vendor?

inc rolanberry fields right outside the clusterfuck of the marketwards.

They DID say that the vendor-bought stuff was really expensive, but that was as a level 1 character, obviously.

You're entirely right though. I really like the depth of the crafting system, and you can get some really cool looking items from it, but the outlet for crafters currently is subpar.

After reading today's interviews, and some of the stuff people were posting on the beta forums about how Retainers/MW are great and an AH isn't needed, I actually WENT to the Market Ward to see what it is currently like, as I haven't been since they were implemented.

What I saw was a bunch of rigid mannequins (retainers seem to have no animations?) standing around with bazaar symbols over their heads. Now, granted, the shop interface opened up pretty fast here, but then Kefka is now pretty much dead. Dunno if its people having given up in response to today's interviews, or if people are just waiting for more fixes or what, but there was little in the way of interface lag in the Market Wards (not gone entirely, but noticably less).

So I ran around and noticed 2 things:

1) Even in a pretty lag-free environment, the targeting system still kinda sucks.
2) There is 100% no way to search for items without taking forever to examine every. single. retainer.

I did this for two whole wards before giving up and Teleporting out.

I did finally find a few crafted items today, so there must be some very masochistic people out there to force themselves through the laggy UI to actually rank up their crafting.

As for spamming leves for gear, I seem to keep getting the same thing over and over again. I haven't had a fresh leve reward since the start of p3.

Still, I finally got myself a Robe of Sexiness thanks to some guy who was selling the rank 20 version:

http://demajen.co.uk/ffxiv/shots/robe_of_sexiness.jpg

[Kirb]

Like you said, both extreme negativity and extreme positivity are very annoying to read.

Christ, you said it. Sometimes it's like trying to read a political article written by a bipolar person. On speed.

2) There is 100% no way to search for items without taking forever to examine every. single. retainer.

This is probably my biggest problem, they absolutely need a way to search through all the retainers via a UI function. I'm honestly pretty sure they know this, though, judging by their answer in the interview, so hopefully we'll be seeing some form of it either by retail if they bust their asses, or more realistically, in the first patch.


Also, dat robe.

[ascalon]

Oh, one thing I do like about the retainer/bazaar system in game, though, is the option to put up stuff you want to buy.

I ran around and sold quite a few shards to people because I'm not using them for anything, and made about 10k gil doing so.

Of course, you have to have some of that item already in your inventory before you can look for more... ¬_¬

This is probably my biggest problem, they absolutely need a way to search through all the retainers via a UI function. I'm honestly pretty sure they know this, though, judging by their answer in the interview, so hopefully we'll be seeing some form of it either by retail if they bust their asses, or more realistically, in the first patch.

With a search function it should work. It'll look a lot like an auction house, but it'll work....

[Cichy]

People half-joke about that defensive shit because even legitimate concerns get bombed with it.
Mouse control terrible? "FFXI was fine without it! SE knows what they're doing!"
Crafting system is unintuitive, clunky and needs a recipe book? "They're doing it to stop bots/control the economy/make crafting more of an accomplishment". Oh, and insert a stab at Wow.

It's something that happens often with online game beta's though. APB also had a very vocal part of the beta community that loved the game to bits. Sadly, the game had huge and legitimate issues, but complaints about them by more critical testers got flamed and minimalised. The critical testers (rightly) proclaimed that the game couldn't go to retail in the state it was in, yet it did (not solely due to the supportive testers of course), where it failed pretty spectacularly.

Supportive testers will respond to flaws by saying that they're unique or different, even if they're that just for the sake of being unique or different. Failing that, they'll act like any proper MMO-addict would and say to hold out for the next patch (hell, people are even calling for the next expansion here). The patch that will fix EVERYTHING. As we all know, those patches do not exist in MMO's. Especially with SE's track record (see the 2h update or really, a lot of issues).

Like you said, both extreme negativity and extreme positivity are very annoying to read. I'm really hoping it'll turn out well, but SE has been slacking in updates, and especially in communication. Yet I have to say, I'm seeing a lot more people respond, even to justified, non-ranty criticism with SE's own "Working as intended!". That's really not helping anyone.

I played ffxi for number of years, huge fan of FF, pre-ordered a collectors edition for 14, playing beta now and I do agree its not rdy for retail. As much as I want it to be a huge success I dont see how its going to do that in current state and the state they want to release it in. Simple things like party based play doesnt even work correct.
Here's my last party experiance: me and a lancer go to fight a puk, lancer is lvl 11 goes hits the puk few times and loses about half hp, I cast stoneskin with my lvl 8 conjurer and its the 1st action I do altogether, puk comes and kills me in few hits.
Things like enmity, exp gained, etc still need fixes. I really dont want another FFXI where in 5 years the game finally will work like it should and classes will be somehow balanced.

[Kuya]

Of course, you have to have some of that item already in your inventory before you can look for more... ¬_¬

That is just stupid.

[Uzor]

Yes, there is about 20 market wards and the thing that would help a ton I think would be if there was a number which would indicate how many retainers are in each ward.

Don't forget there will also be 3 or 4 cities with market zones you'd have to check through, as well.

[Ghostsix.Midgard]

Steps Forward from XI

Spoiler: show

-Can "seek" items in Bazaar
-Job system is like having subjobs unlocked from level 1. (This can go either way, there was a sense of accomplishment from unlocking sub jobs)
-60 fps
-Deeper crafting system which puts you in direct control of HQ results.
-Retainers
-Multi Linkshell text at once
-Stat allocation
-Visible stats (accuracy/M. Acc)
-Visible Accessories (Rings, Necklace, bracelet earrings)
-movable/sizable chat window
-Cutscenes
-Emotes
-visible mini map

Steps Backwards from XI

Spoiler: show

-Less Macros, No named macro books.
-No Ah
-Can't move/walk while browsing Bazaars
-limited Personal Teleports that use points and regen at the rate of about 1 teleport per day?
-No advanced classes (yet)
-No quests. (repeatable or otherwise).
-Nation Missions so far is a joke. There is only cutscene dialog, outside of one escort against 5 "pops" that can all be one shotted.
-Excessive redundant menus.
-No Hardware Mouse/custom keybinds
-No exp chain system/bonus of any type.
-Gearset not saved between class change
-Less storage (80+80)
-No personal space (mog house)
-Spells automatically learned (no reason to farm)
-Nothing to farm from mobs except craft mats. No weapons/gear/spells/gil dropped from random mobs.
-No friend list
-no sit =(
-Lethargic fishing system... (can't reel in monsters, and if you could, lol throw stone)
-Check system based on party strength (This is unbalanced)
-Grid system on the map is number+number instead of Letter number. Which number comes first?
-Text commands gone. Cannot assist, reply, <bt> <st> <call> <nominate> etc
-Cannot check other players
-Claimed mobs/other peoples Guild leve mobs names are not colored.
-No call for help.
-Cannot reraise/return until entire party is dead or has zero aggro.
-No defensive skillups (parry, evasion)
-Gatherers can't defend against aggro (must buy class specific skill to avoid aggro)
-can't view party members on large map
-Can't mark custom spots on world map
-can't sign crafted items

Shit I'm confident will get fixed

Spoiler: show

-Player search not working
-No Gmcall
-Broken Skillchains (Battle Regimens)
-hate system broken