Tanaka blames foreign sites for rumors + XP Discussion

[Lucavi]

Since for-fucking-ever.
If on release, people think the game sucks and tell their friends the game sucks... the game isn't going to do well later on.

Ding ding fucking ding.

Do you honestly think that if the PC release and review of this game fucking flops because of tremendous amounts of negative press the likes that only AOC and Vanguard received, people will somehow "flock" to the PS3 version?

Initial reviews are EVERYTHING to MMOs - the very lifeblood. AOC is a GOOD game now - it has issues, but every game has issues. AOC struggles to hit maybe 110k subs now, because of a full year of terrible press and terrible, crippling bugs. AOC could promise a free blowjob from everyone's high school/college crush for each month of subscription and it would do no good at this point - the damage has been done.

If people think that planning for the "long term" is going to save this MMO, I'd ask them to name another popular, successful MMO that has successfully revived itself to the point of being an actual contender in the MMO field. AC2 didn't do it. AOC didn't do it. Vanguard didn't do it. DnD Online didn't do it. Hellgate: London didn't do it. Star Trek Online didn't do it. The Matrix Online didn't do it.

Don't believe for an instant that SE's name is enough to save their projects, especially after FFXIII was trashed worldwide for its linear structure. This is not 1998. This is not 2005.

[xopher]

FFXIV is largely incomplete. I believe this system is being implemented to keep you from progressing too far, too quickly. That way SE has time to develop more content. I mentioned this earlier in the thread but I'm fleshing it out now.

They are releasing it now because they said they'd have it out before the end of 2010 and they have to stick to their guns because that's how the Japanese are.

I also think that the level cap increases in FFXI are going to be staggered out farther than the initial six month plan because of this. They're wanting people to have soemthing to do while they develop more of FFXIV's content.

We all expected the next set of levels to be 81-90. They said they'd have the level caps done within a six month window, but I highly doubt they'll do 86-99 in one update.

[shidobu]

When SE locks non-endgame content behind 'glad you enjoyed that cutscene and easy 6-man battle, but the next door is locked, please wait until the next content patch' people RAGE because they paid full retail price for an expansion that's delivered to them over six $13 subscription payments.

Cuz nobody gives a shit about the storyline. They just want the fucking rajas rings and stupid helmets you get for grinding through it.

Last time i was impressed with a fucking storyline was the final Promithia battle. I actually said "wow they put some fucking work into this, well worth the wait/bullshit to get to it." (pre fuckin omega/ultima nerfs)

90% of the XI community dont care about the CS, just the rewards they can get.

[Charismatic]

FFXI was not like that.

Please, if you can, prove them that the FFXI way won't work anymore.

FFXI hit its peak at CoP, you're only fooling yourself.

[Hyan]

Initial reviews are EVERYTHING to MMOs - the very lifeblood. AOC is a GOOD game now - it has issues, but every game has issues.

AoC was and is still shit.

[omegaB]

With this system, SE can make make the game less grindy. If the system works as it should, it won't be a snails pace, because that's exactly what SE wants to avoid with this system.

no, they just make it grind out over longer time, the grind is the same grind no matter how much rest you take.

You can walk up stairs, or you can run upstairs, its the same amount of stairs either way. this doesnt lower the time it takes to reach the next level, it just makes you space it out.

people say people get bored at cap, well hey guys people get bored taking 1 step every half hour. People lose interest if you make them wait too long, at least with level caps, people can say, hey ill wait until 1 year to play so i can zoom through it, with this you have like no options better to just take it out and let people hit the cap, then switch jobs if they want to, then to do this.

[Katlan]

With this system, SE can make make the game less grindy. If the system works as it should, it won't be a snails pace, because that's exactly what SE wants to avoid with this system.

Sorry Hyan, but are you blind / can not read correctly?

The grind in all it's glory is sill there. Your not magically grinding less by playing w/in the 8hour a week window. All SE is doing is putting a cap on how much you "can" grind so that ppl who play more then that "cap" don't pass those who play w/in that cap. And if your telling me you regularly play a mmo for only 8hours a week then wut? That's what ppl do in mmo's when they hit endgame and only play for endgame

[Hyan]

FFXI hit its peak at CoP, you're only fooling yourself.

So XIV will hit it's peak during the 2nd expansion pack?

This is what you're going to say to the developers? Oh my, that's a horrible thought.

The grind in all it's glory is sill there. Your not magically grinding less by playing w/in the 8hour a week window. All SE is doing is putting a cap on how much you "can" grind so that ppl who play more then that "cap" don't pass those who play w/in that cap. And if your telling me you regularly play a mmo for 8hours a week then wut?

Yes, I am. It's why this system is in place. I can get a lot more done in that time than if there was no cap, because in that case SE would either cut the EXP or raise the tnl's.

[Charismatic]

First expansion released for the world outside of Japan... you know the game came WITH Zilart for everyone else but them, right?
Did you even play FFXI?

[Acturus]

I'm all for reasonable levels of corporate social responsibility, especially in the gaming industry, but for a second attempt (FFXI's disclaimer screen was laughable), this is pretty shitty. If for no other reason than if this penalty is partly due to CSR, then it feels like they tried to slip it in unnoticed. If a company is going to care about protecting their players, then it's insulting that they don't offer full disclosure to those players.

As for initial revenue, SE has something that Blizzard didn't have, a loyal fanbase ready to adopt the new product. If we claim that initial revenue means little in an MMO, then we are shortchanging the impact of the Final Fantasy name. Sure, WoW gained it's vaunted "10 million" users over a pretty long period of time (3 years, was it?, middle of Burning Crusade?), but it wasn't like WoW was out for half a decade and then suddenly exploded. It gained and gained steadily over a period of time.

I argue that SE has an obligation to provide an amazing launch, because they have a dedicated fan base ready to pre-order and start from the very beginning. If you upset your community, then there's little hope of recovering. Fans run fansites, and to FFXI at least, fansites meant everything. I believe the community who has been exposed to the Beta to this point would welcome a delay if it meant meaningful change to some pretty glaring issues that the players have and the developers seem to recognize.

[Hyan]

Ive come to the conclusion Hyan is just retarded /thread

I've come to the conclusion that you sure know how to argue!

First expansion released for the world outside of Japan... you know the game came WITH Zilart for everyone else but them, right?
Did you even play FFXI?

And only because a better game was released during CoP.

What exactly is your point? Because at some point later on, a better MMO just might come out, SE should not do it the way they did it in XI?

[Lucavi]

With this system, SE can make make the game less grindy. If the system works as it should, it won't be a snails pace, because that's exactly what SE wants to avoid with this system.

If I want to play a game for 10 hours a week, SE "making things less grindy" for me isn't worth shit.

I, personally, never had a problem with grind in MMOs. I had a problem with balance in FFXI, and how lack of balance crippled not only social interactions (LOLDRG/DRK/BST!) but the leveling speed of those jobs. That was my only "grind" problem - the fact that some jobs had to spend days seeking for a lucky party invite while others were offered money to join up.

I'll say it again: I don't mind the grind in this game. I LOVED grinding in Alpha! Do you know why? Because my Lancer had actual armor, my lancer didn't whiff 70% of the time, and because I found mobs I could either solo with a good challenge, or other mobs that I could trio effectively.

If fighting is fun, then grind becomes irrelevant. I don't think I heard one person in any brd/dnc/pld/sam/rdm/drg party whining about "grinding" in FFXI. We had fun. We laughed, tore shit up, plowed through mobs, leveled up at a decent clip, then disbanded and went on our merry ways. In some cases, that "grind" actually made the rest of our day, not to mention our FFXI gaming day, better.

SE has shown that they're willing to kill off fun just to "prevent" the notion of grinding, which is 34 kinds of retarded. It literally makes my forehead hurt trying to comprehend this decision.

If you balance a game to the point where fighting is fun, "grind" becomes irrelevant.

Did I hate "grinding" in FF Tactics when I got my characters the spells I wanted? No.
Did I hate "grinding" in Ogre Battle 64: when I got my Paladins and Dark Knights? No.
Did I hate "grinding" in FF4 when I got Kain back in the Tower of Zot? No.
Did I hate "grinding" in Diablo 2 when I had an 8-man party rolling through another NM run? No.

Grinding isn't the problem. Fun is, and this system is -not- fun.

[Lordender]

Lol if anything I thought 14 was a lot more grindy than 11 on the beta. Guildleve's got done really quick and it was off to finding mobs to grind. The game seemed hella boring to me from what i've seen so far.

Guildleve's was the only time I actually had fun in the beta and you don't get nearly enough of them.

[millionsknives]

As far as the actual grinding goes, I wouldn't be surprised if you could get a lot more done in those 8 hours than in FFXI.

Yeh, you can probably get more levels in XIV's 8 hours compared to XI's 8 hours play, but the difference is if you take a larger time period like a month, you're likely overall advancing at the same slow rate on XIV as XI as the former limited your play time. Which is only ok for people who play 8 hours or less a week.

[Hyan]

Yeh, you can probably get more levels in XIV's 8 hours compared to XI's 8 hours play, but the difference is if you take a larger time period like a month, you're likely overall advancing at the same slow rate on XIV as XI as the former limited your play time. Which is only ok for people who play 8 hours or less a week.

Vertically, yes. Horizontally, no.

If I want to play a game for 10 hours a week, SE "making things less grindy" for me isn't worth shit.

And this system lets you play the game for 10 hours a week, my love.

[FailureMidgard]

They didn't quit with WoW's end-game, and this is the last time I'm referencing WoW, but everyone and their mother keeps bringing it up.

Hardcores in vanilla were grinding the shit out of what little end-game there was. They still had instances to level up and gear up in, and people may not remember, but XP gains were SLOW in vanilla. It took many months for people to hit max level, and MANY months to get "end-game" achievements like having an epic mount. It used to be just as shocking in WoW to see a max level paladin with an Epic charger than it was shocking to see some JP with a relic weapon or Kclub.

Are you crazy? People hit 60 in 1-2 weeks. I personally grinded it pretty fast, and I also had an Epic mount that same day (though I took a small loan from a friend, I paid it back within 1 week). Just because you had no clue what you weer doing, doesn't mean that's how the game was.



But ya, this looks like retarded bullshit, and also, to whomever mentioned the Aion release earlier - try Anarchy Online's release, was one of the worst MMO releases to date, they lost tons of people because of how shitty it was, yet 1 year later I tried it again with a free trial, and the game was actually pretty good. And since the clarification was posted in English, it looks like the people arguing the semantics of it being the same as WoW's sytem but described differently are just completely wrong.

[Hyan]

It's about time for everyone to group together and "umad" at me without any sort of argument. It's what always happens when you try to go against the accepted norms.

Remember kids, god exists.

[Acturus]

Lol if anything I thought 14 was a lot more grindy than 11 on the beta. Guildleve's got done really quick and it was off to finding mobs to grind. The game seemed hella boring to me from what i've seen so far.

Guildleve's was the only time I actually had fun in the beta and you don't get nearly enough of them.

QFT

I sincerely hope that the Leve system is expanded to three or four times what it is in Beta.

[Katlan]

Lol if anything I thought 14 was a lot more grindy than 11 on the beta. Guildleve's got done really quick and it was off to finding mobs to grind. The game seemed hella boring to me from what i've seen so far.

Guildleve's was the only time I actually had fun in the beta and you don't get nearly enough of them.

Leve's were fun at first, but doing the same X/8 over and over again is kinda tedious. How many zikko's does it take to get to the new mob design?

[Lucavi]

And this system lets you play the game for 10 hours a week, my love.

At that point, you're doing nothing but going through the motions and frustrating yourself.

I've got an idea - why don't we keep a number log of people's NM kills. Every time you kill a NM, the droprate for that NM goes down by 3% for you and everyone in your group. To reset the value, you have to not engage or claim that mob for a month. That'll extend content by making it so that there's less farming of NMs and everyone gets to progress with endgame gear at the same rate!

Everyone wins! Yaaay!