Job Adjustments Part II (09/03/2010)

[thetruepandagod]

And war just keeps on getting more and more broken.

But i like that.

[Spider-Dan]

Sometimes I think you exist just to troll people. Why do you think BRD is getting Tenuto if people who cast songs or rolls on other people as a support job should not be concerned about what songs or rolls they maintain on themselves?

Imagine that BRD had the ability to randomly "critical" a song, causing SV potency and Troubadour duration.
Now imagine that Tenuto removed this ability.

You're telling me that people would even allow BRD to use Tenuto? GTFO.

edit:
And let's not get this twisted: BRDs are getting Tenuto so they can do things like keep Marches on themselves or keep Ballads on themselves (i.e. to help them increase their support ability). Every single COR that complains about XI rolls ruining his personal buff is an e-peener concerned with his place on the parse that's complaining about being stuck with Evoker's. The only non-DD support roll that matters to COR is Evoker's, so even if you rolled XI on a melee roll, you can always put Evoker's back up.

[Jeryhn]

And war just keeps on getting more and more broken.

But i like that.

That depends. The update teaser said that Restraint would no longer fully restrict critical hits. It didn't say anything about not restricting critical hits at all.

Seems to me that they'll allow crits, but crit rate will still be reduced.

[Jeryhn]

Imagine that BRD had the ability to randomly "critical" a song, causing SV potency and Troubadour duration.
Now imagine that Tenuto removed this ability.

You're telling me that people would even allow BRD to use Tenuto? GTFO.

Doesn't make sense as an argument, because that's not what's happening with COR, idiot.

[LinkNZ]

Hmm, some very nice changes in there. This update is full of so much win. :D

I admit I'm very jealous though about all the new toys BSTs get to play with these last 2 updates. Hopefully we get at least 1 new proper avatar on SMN before all is said-and-done.

[Snick]

Corsair is a better DD than THF

No, COR should always sub WHM and never ever do any type of damage under any circumstances.

[Foldypaws]

...which is still inferior to currently existing Marches, based on potency...

In fairness, Marches may help you recast Ichi faster, but Caster's Roll will help you *cast* Ichi faster, which may be superior for certain mobs.

Haste only affects recast, it doesn't touch cast time. Likewise, if you're trying to get a nuke in a window of vulnerability(which certain NMs do), Caster's Roll is where it's at.

The two are different.

[Spider-Dan]

Doesn't make sense as an argument, because that's not what's happening with COR, idiot.

Let me try to walk you through this slowly:

- COR has a random chance of causing a super-powerful buff (XI)
- This super powerful buff will have a double duration
- The tradeoff for this is that COR may be stuck with a buff that they don't personally like

Your argument is that the possibility of a support job being stuck with an extremely powerful buff (let's be honest: we are talking about Evoker's) is so undesirable that it's worth throwing away the extended duration (at max potency, mind you) for the rest of the party.

That position is, in a word, retarded. Nobody cares what buff the COR is stuck with, and IF they did, instead of nerfing XI, how about just giving COR a Tenuto equivalent instead?

This would be a good time for someone to chime in some more about how SE is "shitting on" BRD.

[Gergall]

I'm pretty sure Curdled Plasma Broth is going to be for a clot. Just look up curdled, plasma, and clot. It fits.





Watch it be a single bat.

Wouldn't Curdled Plasma Broth be made FROM a clot, not to summon a clot?

Fish Oil Broth does not summon a fish. Carrot Broth does not summon a carrot.

[Malacite]

Everything in this update is 100% win except PR duration nerf & Battery Charge nerf. I'd rather have 4/tick for less time than 3/tick for a longer duration, especially when using it with Diffusion.


LOVE Ninjutsu buff, omg please actually be an appreciable buff too, not something stupid like MAB +10~15 ... Base damage increase go! PUP really got some nice love here too wow, sucks that they still haven't put out any new attachments though. Where's Tension Spring III already? I'm starting to wonder if at 99 you'll be able to merit elemental slots on the automaton, which while cool, would be better off as just an update to the job.


I'm torn on which part of this I like best, but I'm really leaning on the SMN stuff. Talk about overdue good lord, SMN skill was the only skill that worked in that retarded manner and it's about fucking time they fixed it. Now if they'd just do the same for Rage pacts and avatar stats in general, we'd be set (maybe take another look at their damage caps too? It's pretty retarded that their crits hit just as hard as regular strikes because their damage is hard capped)

Also very very grateful for the perp adjustment. Diablos' consumption just went through the roof when I hit 80 omg. Anyone else think that his favor might just go up 1 more MP at 85?

[Kaslo]

Carrot Broth does not summon a carrot.

For some reason this is the funniest statement I have heard in a while.

[barber2006]

Do CORs ever get 'stuck' with evokers? No need to double up on 5 (lucky) and 6-8 are the same with 9 sucking. The only possible roll combination I would ever see an 11 on is a 4 followed by a 6 then using snake eyes to hit 11. That is such a rare occurrence its barely worth mentioning. Then again, I suppose there are those who DU on 6 when using evokers but it doesn't seem practical.

[Purrloin]

Wouldn't Curdled Plasma Broth be made FROM a clot, not to summon a clot?

Fish Oil Broth does not summon a fish. Carrot Broth does not summon a carrot.

There's a point here. Clot should be summoned by KFC Gravy Broth.

[Alkar]

Do CORs ever get 'stuck' with evokers? No need to double up on 5 (lucky) and 6-8 are the same with 9 sucking. The only possible roll combination I would ever see an 11 on is a 4 followed by a 6 then using snake eyes to hit 11. That is such a rare occurrence its barely worth mentioning. Then again, I suppose there are those who DU on 6 when using evokers but it doesn't seem practical.

Why wouldn't you Double-Up on a 6 exactly?...
BRD and COR are meant to be different which is why BRD doesn't have DD tools or COR doesn't have Pianissimo and Tenuto.
If COR was simply meant to roll, why did they give us B rating in Markmanship and access to lots of DD gear to begin with? Not to mention rolls being completely independent from stats and gear unlike Songs.
Others may not care what rolls I have on me but I do. If I'm DDing I don't wanna be stuck with Evoker's/ Scholar's and if I'm curing I don't want a DD roll or 2 DD rolls taking up space.
If you're not using all your tools to roll an 11 on any roll you do, you're just gimping yourself as a COR.
Gimping my other abilities as a COR because I'm playing right is just the wrong way to go. It's not e-peen, it's common sense.

[Kuishen]

Corsair is a better DD than THF

I giggled.

[Isiolia]

Isn't this like saying that RDM is desired because of "a handful of spells" or SAM is desired because of a "handful of WSes"? Being desired for a few REALLY IMPORTANT THINGS is far superior, in practice, to being desired for a bunch of little things.

And again, it bears mentioning that the SINGLE thing that COR was most desired far was rendered irrelevant.

Except when you start having people stepping on the toes of those standout things.

For example, the only real buff that BRD has over COR is March. Which COR isn't getting -exactly-, but is getting effectively in two separate rolls. Why? Because apparently COR is immune from tier-ups, and has to get shiny new rolls. Where's the DA song, XP bonus song, MAB song, etc?

COR still offers a potent ATT buff, a variety of magic-related buffs, and more.

...which BRD has had since before COR was released...

And? It was a unique thing BRD could do. Until they put in Bolter's, with fewer restrictions...granted, they're making things equal with this patch, but still. There was no reason COR "had" to have Bolter's at all anyway.

...which is still inferior to currently existing Marches, based on potency...

Well, yes and no. First, it's a different effect, as Marches don't help cast time in the slightest. Second, compared to a single march, it's not necessarily far off.

March

Again, the one big stand-out buff from BRD...and COR gets something similar. Really, not just BRD, but DNC too. Why does COR get to step on so many toes just to avoid getting tier-ups?

I love how you refer to a 66% increase in BRD's refresh capability as simply "tier-ups."

Evoker's already potentially adds 3-5MP/tick in a single buff slot. Ballad III will presumably be 3MP/tick. So, sure, a BRD could do 5MP/tick reliably...but that'd be the net sum of their benefit to the players with that applied.

Well, considering that every single BRD song is on it's own recast timer (as opposed to one shared timer for all COR rolls) and song recasts are 12-24 seconds (as opposed to 45-60 seconds for rolls), COR's roll duration seems appropriate.

Yet the mechanics of songs require a lot more time on the part of a BRD. SE isn't exactly doing jack or shit about that, and instead put in yet more to reward CORs for rolling lucky numbers.

[Byrthnoth]

I giggled.

Depends how you count it. I am certain a party with 3 DDs, COR, BRD, and a haster does more damage than 3DDs, BRD, THF, and a haster.

[Sylvrdragon]

Are you seriously bitching about other jobs getting BRD's toys? Welcome to the world of the fucking Red Mage (and White Mage before them). It's been happening to us for years and years. You know what we found out? As long as all this shit stacks, you still have a place. So stop your bitching. Every job overlaps somewhere with another job. It was made that way on purpose do that you didn't NEED a specific job to accomplish something.

[Isiolia]

Are you seriously bitching about other jobs getting BRD's toys? Welcome to the world of the fucking Red Mage (and White Mage before them). It's been happening to us for years and years. You know what we found out? As long as all this shit stacks, you still have a place. So stop your bitching. Every job overlaps somewhere with another job. It was made that way on purpose do that you didn't NEED a specific job to accomplish something.

RDM was my first job. I know how it is. Point is more that BRD, as the original buffing job, one that's still basically just focused on that (and pulling), is really not getting a lot added. In terms of buffs, BRD is already crappy unless stacking buffs with another job (or 2hr'ing) because of the two-song limit. The cumulative effect is already what's desirable.

[Shenrien]

>_> I'm hoping to see a part III but doubting it, there is a major lack tho in all the other jobs for this update.