Abyssea Discussion II: Finally, a reason to be Windurstian..

[Jeryhn]

I can confirm that both Merit and Furtherance bonuses will not work until you zone and reapply the buffs.

[Salodin]

So wait, the hp bonus doesn't mess with sorcerer's ring?

[Byrthnoth]

Nor do they mess with Minstrel's. My force set still works.

[Hanyoko]

So wait, the hp bonus doesn't mess with sorcerer's ring?

Lets say you have 1,000 hp on blm and you have latent gear that puts you at 745 hp (74%).
Lets pretend you have 50% hp cruor buff
1000 -> 1500 745 -> 1117 which 1117 is still 74% of 1500
Therefore your gear to force latent hp still functions with abyssea buffs.

And I must add; it is rather hilarious to be at latent hp and still have more hp then some of the melee :3

[Not Kuno]

Lets say you have 1,000 hp on blm and you have latent gear that puts you at 745 hp (74%).
Lets pretend you have 50% hp cruor buff
1000 -> 1500 745 -> 1117 which 1117 is still 74% of 1500
Therefore your gear to force latent hp still functions with abyssea buffs.

And I must add; it is rather hilarious to be at latent hp and still have more hp then some of the melee :3

Huh? Instead of needing 255 hp gear or so you need 400. >_>;

[Byrthnoth]

When you force, you change your base HP. Outside Abyssea for Sorc Ring, you need to be below 75-76% HP to trigger it.

1000 -> 750 when you force out of Abyssea
1000*1.5 -> 750*1.5 when you force inside Abyssea
1500 -> 1125 when you force in Abyssea
1125/1500 = 75%, your ring works

I haven't actually tested with Sorc Ring itself, but I know it works with Minstrel's Ring. Sorc Ring has always been a little different than the other rings, but I assume it would work the same way. It is possible that you can no longer use your Convert HP -> MP gear with it, because:

Before, outside Abyssea:
750HP/930HP with 70 Convert HP->MP (1000 effective to Sorc ring) = Sorc Ring is active

Now, inside Abyssea:
(750HP*1.5) / (930HP*1.5) with 70 Convert HP->MP
1125 / 1395 with 70 Convert HP->MP (1465 effective to Sorc ring) = ~77% HP = Sorc Ring not active.

[Hanyoko]

/sigh I dont know why this is becoming more complicated then it has to be.

If you can activate your latent via gear swaps to reduce your hp to your magical hp% outside of abyssea; then because the cruor modifiers happen as a last step you will be able to activate latent inside abyssea.
Whatever your percentage needs to be (idk i personally dont nuke/cure in convert hp->mp gear so less then 75% works)

At least that has been my experience with both sorc ring and medicine ring.

*edit* i do now see how this can get messed up if your nuking IN convert gear

[Jeryhn]

If you can activate your latent via gear swaps to reduce your hp to your magical hp% outside of abyssea; then because the cruor modifiers happen as a last step you will be able to activate latent inside abyssea.
Whatever your percentage needs to be (idk i personally dont nuke/cure in convert hp->mp gear so less then 75% works)

Basically what he's saying is that if your ring works outside of Abyssea, it will work inside as well. Just because you get +500hp using a Cruor Prospector buff in Abyssea does not mean you need to update your latent gear or drop your ring, or worse, consider not getting the HP buff from a Cruor Prospector.

The HP/MP buffs are considered a status effect, and the bonus is applied AFTER gear/merit bonuses. The latents on Sorc/Minstrel's/etc Rings are based upon your base HP, unbuffed.

EDIT: Pretty sure you can test this using a Body Boost in Nyzul as well. As I recall, Body Boost also doesn't affect latent conditions on Sorc/Minstrel's Rings because its considered a status effect.

[Classikmage]

Man, completely didn't think of that. I've been leaving off HP buff whenever I go into Abyssea on BLM. But it actually makes perfect sense.

It's the same concept as Sorcerer's Belt. The +20 HP on that doesn't fuck w/ the setup either. That's a big "dur" moment there. ><

[Hanyoko]

Basically what he's saying is that if your ring works outside of Abyssea, it will work inside as well. Just because you get +500hp using a Cruor Prospector buff in Abyssea does not mean you need to update your latent gear or drop your ring, or worse, consider not getting the HP buff from a Cruor Prospector.

The HP/MP buffs are considered a status effect, and the bonus is applied AFTER gear/merit bonuses. The latents on Sorc/Minstrel's/etc Rings are based upon your base HP, unbuffed.

EDIT: Pretty sure you can test this using a Body Boost in Nyzul as well. As I recall, Body Boost also doesn't affect latent conditions on Sorc/Minstrel's Rings because its considered a status effect.

Body boost, ASA final fight buff, etc etc I'm rather sure its the same buff just different potency.

[Uubu]

random tidbit, you can get the abyssites and i assume atma if your on the hatelist and not in PT when the mob dies.. Was building lights on Spiders and got iktomi + 10 adds and proceeded to wipe, then a bst claimed it and killed it and the members of our group that didnt have the abyssite got it on the bst's kill.

[kenshyn]

random tidbit, you can get the abyssites and i assume atma if your on the hatelist and not in PT when the mob dies.. Was building lights on Spiders and got iktomi + 10 adds and proceeded to wipe, then a bst claimed it and killed it and the members of our group that didnt have the abyssite got it on the bst's kill.

Now that is very very interesting no need to swap people in out at the end would be cool. Curious if you never had claim just spammed cures on ppl fighting nm to get on the hate list would that work as well this would change how we do abyssea hunts in the future if this is possible for sure.

[Kilik]

random tidbit, you can get the abyssites and i assume atma if your on the hatelist and not in PT when the mob dies.. Was building lights on Spiders and got iktomi + 10 adds and proceeded to wipe, then a bst claimed it and killed it and the members of our group that didnt have the abyssite got it on the bst's kill.

Did you actually touch Iktomi? If you tagged it then had an outside party/alliance kill it without it completely deaggro'ing, then it still counted as you having first claim. Only your alliance would get the abyssite. I had a solo RDM claim Iktomi then pass it off to my party without losing hate. He ended up getting abyssite. Though I guess my example is a bad one since the people in my group already had the abyssite so I can't 100% say we wouldn't have gotten it.

I have a theory for abyssites from mobs. Because it seems to be based on who tags it first, it seems the abyssite will drop to that one person and then "spread" to their alliance. Same would apply for Atmas. In the NM Weakness thread, I had a post talking about a Bukhis fight where I triggered Red !! with Jinpu, but died at the end of the fight. The LS members that didn't have Atma did not get it for that fight even though we only triggered Red !! once. This would follow the "spreading". Since I was dead and I couldn't receive it, the source for the rest of the alliance to get it was cut off.

For abyssites, you could test this by having someone pop or pull an abyssite dropping mob while in an ally, then drop and join an outside ally. See which group gets the key item.

For atma, have person that triggers Red !! go to an outside alliance when the mob dies. I could see this being useful for LS's that have 18 ppl fighting, but people have mules they want to get atmas on. If it works, you could just have whoever triggers the Red go to the mule ally to get them the Atma.

Edit: Would also be useful for selling Atmas. Make an outside group of people who are there to buy and have the person that triggers join that group at the end of the fight.

[Klaatu]

Once and for all. Do Resistance Ops give fame?

[Jeryhn]

Yes, they do.

[Klaatu]

Cool thanks. Reason I asked because the only possible way of raising fame in Attohwa that doesn't require Pseudopods would be Ops then. Glad they are repeatable and give fame.

[Uubu]

yes we started fighting iktomi before it and adds wiped us, pretty sure the bst got it with partial health and i dont know if he got the key item.


Also i saw in another thread that bhukis hp superior atma is actually less then dorians 30% atma? is this the same as the atma from Yaanei?

[Taint]

If you got 2A the drops are a little more varied than I thought~

Just wanted to confirm you can definitely get 2A only, happened for us last night.

[ronin sparthos]

How many Campaign OP repeats generally get you to Rank3 fame?

[Hanyoko]

How many Campaign OP repeats generally get you to Rank3 fame?

Depends on your success rate of the op ; better success tiers seem to grant more fame then lower ones.
So assuming average or poor success 20 ; with great success maybe closer to single digits.