Random Question Thread XIV: No Not XIV, XI

[Thorny]

I'm not sure how your WAR is more durable, unless i'm missing a key aspect of it. My BLM can wear terras besides when casts finish, has mana wall(equivalent of having ~4800 hp.. 1600 mpx2 and base hp), etc. If you're going to argue for cleaveburns using perfect defense, not sure why you don't allow BLM the same luxury. I can safely pull a family on blm without even going through half of my initial mp pool and have convert up still..

Cleave has a lot of benefits, in no way calling it bad, but implying it's the only way is pretty stupid tbh. It takes about 6 -gas to drop a family(~20% for waterja or blizzaga3, bit less on the others), 3 per BLM, 7.5 sec casttime + 2 second stun + 8 sec sleep/reposition = ~50 seconds to floor a pull. Obviously you of all people know splitting up is practical, and every zone has 2-3 viable camps. BLM takes 2 people, cleave takes 4-5. I can even agree cleave is 'better' if only for safety's sake, but to say it's a far and away difference is silly.

@Yugl : Cleave uses perfect defense if done properly, BLMs use sleepga between -gas and the 'numerous temporary items' cruor meds + convert as needed.

[Yugl]

Scratch a zero on that 48,000HP.

[BadKarma]

Scratch a zero on that 48,000HP.

Protip: Don't nitpick Thorny. He will pay it back x10,000

[Yugl]

Nah, he's cool about it.

Edit: Oh, I guess that's why the SMN was there. Good call on convert though since that nearly doubles your HP if timed correctly.

[grozny]

What key items can you get from Konschtat Gold Pyxis? Mainly can I get Twisted Tonberry Crown ?

[Thorny]

What key items can you get from Konschtat Gold Pyxis? Mainly can I get Twisted Tonberry Crown ?

You cannot.

[jurjur]

Is there any special atma required for cleave burning?

Also, does HP+ atma stack with cruour HP buff?

[Kirschy]

Is there any special atma required for cleave burning?

Also, does HP+ atma stack with cruour HP buff?

It's additive. Getting HP+30% atma /w 4 abyssites of merit w/o Pulse Martello bonuses gives you 20%(Base) + 40%(Abyssite) + 30%(Atma) = 90% HP

[Plow]

I'm not sure how your WAR is more durable, unless i'm missing a key aspect of it. My BLM can wear terras besides when casts finish, has mana wall(equivalent of having ~4800 hp.. 1600 mpx2 and base hp), etc. If you're going to argue for cleaveburns using perfect defense, not sure why you don't allow BLM the same luxury. I can safely pull a family on blm without even going through half of my initial mp pool and have convert up still..

Cleave has a lot of benefits, in no way calling it bad, but implying it's the only way is pretty stupid tbh. It takes about 6 -gas to drop a family(~20% for waterja or blizzaga3, bit less on the others), 3 per BLM, 7.5 sec casttime + 2 second stun + 8 sec sleep/reposition = ~50 seconds to floor a pull. Obviously you of all people know splitting up is practical, and every zone has 2-3 viable camps. BLM takes 2 people, cleave takes 4-5. I can even agree cleave is 'better' if only for safety's sake, but to say it's a far and away difference is silly.

@Yugl : Cleave uses perfect defense if done properly, BLMs use sleepga between -gas and the 'numerous temporary items' cruor meds + convert as needed.

Don't forget, if you're doing squibs + apkallu, you can grab fanas from prefect in between pulls and it takes all of 30 seconds to get there and back. Survivability not really an issue for that stuff.

[arus2001]

Been wondering about this on Amun after some LS attempts on it... Does damaging it during spellcasting trigger Catharsis, and in turn, its aura? I've seen people saying lowmanning it's easy, which would make sense in limiting his TP if it's a potential TP move, but even when trying to throw 2 BLMs at it kite style, sometimes it'd cure itself for over 8k, typically when someone tried to drop a SA WS while it's casting mid-kite.

[rog]

It obviously can't ws while casting, but feeding it tp will cause it to ws right after.

It's incredibly easy to duo rdm x2, even with the cures. If you can't do more than 8k damage with 12 nukes, you should go kill yourself.

[Khajit]

How much does N sash go for nowadays? Ls is supposed to kill av later this week and I'm thinking of upgrading my gil.

[arus2001]

It obviously can't ws while casting, but feeding it tp will cause it to ws right after.

It's incredibly easy to duo rdm x2, even with the cures. If you can't do more than 8k damage with 12 nukes, you should go kill yourself.

I didn't say it outright, but it seemed like it was using Catharsis without having been damaged enough for 100+ TP, either. Doesn't rule out a Regain of sorts, but damage wasn't the source of suck. It'd just plain keep outhealing, where pretty much the only thing our extras were doing were stunning or curing if they could or using provoke to pull hate from time to time to give the BLMs some breathing room while I'd yoink hate from them to kite it myself some.


Just trying to ascertain some kind of gimmick to it, which while lowman rdm/nin duos and such may circumvent it, not everyone will have that available at any given moment, or in the case of other activities, not want to give up their lights to job change.

[rog]

Blm should do at least 1500-2k damage per nuke to it, so if you can't outdamage it, you're retarded.

protip: don't use melees. Not even just to ws.

[KSDI]

Recently got back into the game and trying to get up to date with all the new content, what would be the most efficient progression of nms to kill in order to get the right atmas/abbysites to make the rest of the farming easier? I've already gotten most of the atma's and abyssites that are questable/purchaseable without having to kill zone bosses for them now I'm at the point where my group wants to start killing all of those. Which of the first three zone nms should we go after first for our second lunar abyssite? and after that which atma's should we go after first to make everything else easier?

I was thinking we would probably wanna do Briareus or Kukulkan first but I wasn't sure, i've heard Glavoid is the more difficult of the three. And we've gotten some decent melee atmas like the one chloris drops, but we haven't gotten almost any good mage ones, I think the Ovni atma and the lugarhoo atmas are the strongest we have so far in that regard.

So, forgive me because I know my question is somewhat basic and you guys for the most part seem to be leaps and bounds beyond this stuff but any help would be really appreciated.

[FailureMidgard]

I'm not sure how your WAR is more durable, unless i'm missing a key aspect of it. My BLM can wear terras besides when casts finish, has mana wall(equivalent of having ~4800 hp.. 1600 mpx2 and base hp), etc. If you're going to argue for cleaveburns using perfect defense, not sure why you don't allow BLM the same luxury. I can safely pull a family on blm without even going through half of my initial mp pool and have convert up still..

Cleave has a lot of benefits, in no way calling it bad, but implying it's the only way is pretty stupid tbh. It takes about 6 -gas to drop a family(~20% for waterja or blizzaga3, bit less on the others), 3 per BLM, 7.5 sec casttime + 2 second stun + 8 sec sleep/reposition = ~50 seconds to floor a pull. Obviously you of all people know splitting up is practical, and every zone has 2-3 viable camps. BLM takes 2 people, cleave takes 4-5. I can even agree cleave is 'better' if only for safety's sake, but to say it's a far and away difference is silly.

@Yugl : Cleave uses perfect defense if done properly, BLMs use sleepga between -gas and the 'numerous temporary items' cruor meds + convert as needed.

Because I thought half your point was comparing # of people and you were trying to say your 2 is better than my 3 because it's 1 less, if you didn't mean that, then sorry. Even with PD and a 380 stoneskin, tanking 10 mobs hitting for 8 each, you'll lose stoneskin after ~2 agas (more likely sooner than that, TBH). Cleave takes 3 people to work though...we generally have more (end up with some 8+ people leeching low lvl jobs), more obviously kills faster/etc, but is nowhere near needed. In any case, my 3 person cleave party is definitely more durable than your blm duo, and kills faster. Can your duo work? Sure, but my Sam/Brd duo can kill fast enough to end up with positive time too, doesn't mean I'm gonna argue that it has the same kill rate as cleave or 2 black mages -againg.

Blm should do at least 1500-2k damage per nuke to it, so if you can't outdamage it, you're retarded.

protip: don't use melees. Not even just to ws.

I agree it's easy to outdamage it, and maybe this is just me being spoiled with a masamune, but I can kill it sam/brd/rdm faster than 2 rdm/nins can (I've done both methods plenty of times). Yaya, 3 people etc! At the very least, I don't see the problem with melee WSing it, unless they are retarded and swing more than once every time they WS.

[FailureMidgard]

Recently got back into the game and trying to get up to date with all the new content, what would be the most efficient progression of nms to kill in order to get the right atmas/abbysites to make the rest of the farming easier? I've already gotten most of the atma's and abyssites that are questable/purchaseable without having to kill zone bosses for them now I'm at the point where my group wants to start killing all of those. Which of the first three zone nms should we go after first for our second lunar abyssite? and after that which atma's should we go after first to make everything else easier?

I was thinking we would probably wanna do Briareus or Kukulkan first but I wasn't sure, i've heard Glavoid is the more difficult of the three. And we've gotten some decent melee atmas like the one chloris drops, but we haven't gotten almost any good mage ones, I think the Ovni atma and the lugarhoo atmas are the strongest we have so far in that regard.

So, forgive me because I know my question is somewhat basic and you guys for the most part seem to be leaps and bounds beyond this stuff but any help would be really appreciated.

Get the 2 Abyssites of Celerity first (Tonberry + Vunkerl fame) then go for almost anything...Lugarhoo is fine, Minikin is really good and easy to get...Briareus shouldn't take more than 20min to get a pop for, then another 5-10 to kill and atma, etc. Depending if you can make a decent exp party, I'd make one in Konschtat and try to get an Eve set over Briareus, but whatever works in the end. Going for Sojour/Merit/Furtherance abyssites is a good idea as well, so Ovni is a smart target. For abyssites though, I'd aim for something like:

Durinn
Ironclad Pulverizer
Eccentric Eve
Dozing Dorian
Hadal Satiator or Lugarhoo (Hadal is better)

I think those 5 cover almost anything you'd want to do...perhaps a second refresh atma for healers, or Cirien-Croin for bards, but meh.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Still not seeing how your WAR is even remotely as durable as his BLM. Again, if you're including PD, that should be a noted mutual luxury.

[Byrthnoth]

Recently got back into the game and trying to get up to date with all the new content, what would be the most efficient progression of nms to kill in order to get the right atmas/abbysites to make the rest of the farming easier? I've already gotten most of the atma's and abyssites that are questable/purchaseable without having to kill zone bosses for them now I'm at the point where my group wants to start killing all of those. Which of the first three zone nms should we go after first for our second lunar abyssite? and after that which atma's should we go after first to make everything else easier?

I was thinking we would probably wanna do Briareus or Kukulkan first but I wasn't sure, i've heard Glavoid is the more difficult of the three. And we've gotten some decent melee atmas like the one chloris drops, but we haven't gotten almost any good mage ones, I think the Ovni atma and the lugarhoo atmas are the strongest we have so far in that regard.

So, forgive me because I know my question is somewhat basic and you guys for the most part seem to be leaps and bounds beyond this stuff but any help would be really appreciated.

You would be best off doing a new-area Orobon for your Lunar Abyssite. He's easier than some Tier 1 NMs. Just Kite and nuke him with Gravity on. Barring that, Kukulkan isn't that bad to lowman with a few mages and movement speed.

For Mage Atmas, you'd want the Dverger Tier 2 NM in Vunkerl (50 INT and 10 MP/tick Refresh) and perhaps Hadal Satiator (T3 VNM in Konschtat).
For Melee Atmas, you'll want Eccentric Eve and Ironclad Pulverizer. Eve requires decent stunners and Ironclad Pulverizer requires some luck to get the Atma (timing between his swings basically).

The most important Abyssites out there are:
1) Celerity - One buyable, one comes from Konschtat Tonberries (puller only)
2) Sojourn - Ovni (sounds like you may already have it), Treant NM in Attohwa (easier fight than Ovni really, but he has some heavy AoE so don't put a ton of melee on him), Vunkerl Quest (very easy to solo), and the last one is buyable.
3) Furtherances - One from a quest in La Theine that requires farming some Ex items off Pixies and then killing Lugarhoo, second is from Flame Skimmer in Misareaux (again, heavy AoE from Cursed Sphere, hate reset, very high evasion)
4) Merit - Two easy quests, Bhumi (hardly up anymore), and Warbler (wow this guy is a bitch)


I'd recommend you do an xp party on Tonberries in Konschtat to build amber light and Eve/Kukulkan popsets. Have everyone reset hate beforehand and bring a pulling device. It will take a while until Everyone's Grudge gets up to one-shotting potential. This will hopefully get most of you Celerities and get you an Eve/Kukulkan set or two. I recommend ending the party by killing the Tier 2 VNM. If your group is tolerant/longwinded/large enough, you could go straight to killing Eve/Kukulkan/Tier 2/Tier 3 VNMs again. It would knock out the majority of your needs in one day.

[KSDI]

Thanks for the advice that sounds very doable. we do have both furtherance abyssites all the sojourn and two of the merit, need to get the tonberry one and then get moving on the nm kills.