Notorious Monsters, or where's my Leaping lizzy!?

[CrstyCptSteveWitherspoon]

Popped NM's is where it's at, or instance like einherjar. World pop NMs should only exist IF they drop something that can be found somewhere else, not as a main source for something. This way you don't have to camp it for an item, but it's an alternative. Bascially just do what was said above with einherjar, make more items available through it. It can be extreme costs for a super rare item, but at least if you have a price tag on something, and are actively working towards it, you feel some sort of accomplishment rather than just wasting your time everytime something doesn't drop and you have nothing to show for.

[Riposte]

Why isn't this thread in FFXI Advanced? It isn't related to FFXIV at all. Not the one that exists in the real world.

[orson]

It's discussion in relation to how players want FFXIV to be developed. It's very much to do with FFXIV but the advanced nature of this thread is definitely questionable I'd say.

[Riposte]

It's discussion in relation to how players want FFXIV to be developed. It's very much to do with FFXIV but the advanced nature of this thread is definitely questionable I'd say.

That's not what the OP says. Meanwhile there is that fan fiction / bullshit speculation thread.

[miokomioko]

Thank God you're around to rain divine judgement on all the threads unworthy of the Advanced section.

[Riposte]

Someone has to be the smartest man in the room.

[Gulkeeva]

Well there are 2NM looking things

(The buffalo is dam huge)
http://www.neko-sentai.com/images8tu...9-51-10-30.png
http://www.neko-sentai.com//images8t...9-52-07-03.png
(omg does NA model viewer render stuff awesomely)

[CasualPlayer]

When I got my high-end gear, it was because I wanted to be strong, not because I wanted some random guy to look at me and think I was strong. Thankfully I didn't have to cheat for it, or screw someone else over for it, but I felt the same sense of accomplishment in WoW getting my T10.5 set for my Hunter as I did getting full AF2+1, Homam, Barone/conte, ect. for my Drg in FFXI, because I had to work in both to get it. The only difference was that in one, I was always given that opportunity to put the work in each week, while in the other, if some other group botted, my opportunity was gone.

If people want to camp, its because they want to experience the thrill not simply from winning (as any system that promotes a reward after hard work constitutes winning), but from winning over others. It has nothing to do with gear being watered-down if everyone else has it: guess what? You aren't the only person playing the game. Everyone should have the same chance as you to receive the same reward if they work just as hard. Instances allow that to happen. Bottlenecking some of the best items in the game behind one monster on a 24-72 hour singular spawn does not.

If you want to get back to the days where the best bot wins, and the best MPKers rule; the days where cheaters assemble into one dominant force and strangulate servers, then just say so. Say you loved the days of bots and cheaters being misconstrued as "strong", simply because they had the best methods to win; namely, botting an easy monster, then killing said easy monster ad nauseum.

Personally, I'm looking for something that shows a bit more advancement on the system, but seriously, just come out and say that you love bottlenecks where cheaters thrive and honest players suffer. Don't hide behind the bullshit facade of "oh, I only want to see 30 of X item on a server of 13,000, because then the item has value!"

The stats on the item provide the value, not the rarity due to strangulation.

Your not the only type of player in the game dude, plenty of people only wanted gear for show and tell. If you want to have a successful game you need to have something for everyone not just the people who don't want open world HNMs.

To the other point about HMNs that don't drop shit I.E Jorm. There has to be a point in killing it or people won't no matter how cool it is. Can't think of a time I ever ran through Ule range and Jorm wasn't up.

[shepardG]

Someone has to be the smartest man in the room.....and also the douchiest...I smell like vinegar.

Troll on playa, troll on.
But seriously, the discussion has been amazingly cordial, until you came along.

[orson]

Troll on playa, troll on.
But seriously, the discussion has been amazingly cordial, until you came along.

Watch out you sure you want to disrespect the back seat mod with 65 posts? >.>

On a side note didn't this guy steal BRP's avatar/sig?

[Hyan]

He is BRP.

[Ziero]

I like the idea of world spawn NMs if you can can also get the same drops from instances and a point/badge system but why should the world spawns have the better drop rate? I never understand why idiots think it's a good idea to encourage your group to stay up til 4-5 am in the morning instead of just letting them play on their own schedule. Again this is just a frustrating and even unhealthy way of playing games.

Simply put, since you're guaranteed a chance to fight the NM over and over again with an instanced system, it should have a lower drop rate then something that you might not ever get a chance to see. Since part of the "challenge" of getting the drop would also include getting the NM, it should offer more rewards to encourage people to move on to other things besides that one world pop NM.

As long as the rewards are R/E, with a high drop rate and an alternative method of gaining said item, there's going to be little to no reason left for it to be monopolized by a single group. Especially if the mob had an almost completely random pop timer and spawn area.

I mean, I may be speaking out of my ass here, but were Ix and SW really botted that hardcore? I would've figured at the very least it would be more difficult to bot and hold them just on the merit of how they worked. At the very least, those who would bot them should be able to stand out like sore thumbs. Were they pos or flee hacking? Or did they just know where the mob would be before it spawned? Using multiple accounts to watch every zone and just having the bot auto-run to it when the mob spawned?

I mean, I understand the problems that come with World Spawns, but there has to be some way to include them in this game. With the zones and world being as vast as it is, that feeling of random super mobs suddenly appearing to wreak havoc just seems that much more fun. Instances and forced pops are all fine and well, but they don't invoke the same feeling of awe as a massive pissed off super mob popping right in your face unexpectedly.

[OWS_Tonx]

ranger wide scan with a person in each zone lol, pos hacking and flee hack is fucking retarded and anyone who knew what the fuck wouldn't use it for that.

But really am I the only one who enjoyed the 21-24hr and long windowed NMs? Shit was fun to me, even when we didn't claim.

[Alderaan]

I mean, I may be speaking out of my ass here, but were Ix and SW really botted that hardcore?

It's not really only about botting, it's also a huge fucking waste of time. Out of my 1300 game days played in XI, i think maybe a third of that was actual gameplay.

I'm the most competitive person on the world so i forced myself to enjoy camping since it was the only artificial form of competition, but there are better ways to handle that. Mainly properly balanced PVP. Leave the difficulty in PVE for complex and challenging dungeons that actually require skill, teamwork, and communication.

[orson]

@Ziero

It's still stupid because if SE is worried about people spamming the NMs they could simply restrict the amount of times someone could do the instanced NM over a period of time. Similar to EVERY instanced system they've added pretty much. Also the majority of kings drops do have alternatives and are R/EX. Yet kings were still monopolized because R/EX doesn't stop people from selling drops directly. Even if you put in world spawns like DI and SW that are harder to monopolize with 4-6 hr windows you promote the haijin style of gaming that SE has said in the future they want to avoid. World spawns are just a terrible idea unless they're up like 24/7.

Also if that is BRP on a sock then it suddenly all makes sense and the hypocrisy is too funny.

[Deceptistar]

Well there are 2NM looking things

(The buffalo is dam huge)
http://www.neko-sentai.com/images8tu...9-51-10-30.png

thats alot of freaking chest hair...

[miokomioko]

And they are comparable in size to XIII's Adamantoise... which shall be completely awesome.

[Ziero]

ranger wide scan with a person in each zone lol, pos hacking and flee hack is fucking retarded and anyone who knew what the fuck wouldn't use it for that.

But really am I the only one who enjoyed the 21-24hr and long windowed NMs? Shit was fun to me, even when we didn't claim.

So without Widescan one of the biggest issues with wide spawn world pop NMs won't be returning?

@Ziero

It's still stupid because if SE is worried about people spamming the NMs they could simply restrict the amount of times someone could do the instanced NM over a period of time. Similar to EVERY instanced system they've added pretty much. Also the majority of kings drops do have alternatives and are R/EX. Yet kings were still monopolized because R/EX doesn't stop people from selling drops directly. Even if you put in world spawns like DI and SW that are harder to monopolize with 4-6 hr windows you promote the haijin style of gaming that SE has said in the future they want to avoid. World spawns are just a terrible idea unless they're up like 24/7.

Err, Ridill and Defending ring had no real alternatives, which from my understanding where two of the biggest, most wanted drops from Kings. With no other ways to get those items, people could openly sell those drops. Along with anything else the Kings happened to drop. But give players another avenue where they can fight similar mobs with the same drop tables, and you'll see a lot less people willing to buy R/E drops.

That said, I agree about having timed restrictions on Instanced NMs as well, there's no doubt that they'll have something like that in place. Hell, the whole game seems built around that kind of concept. But it still means you're guaranteed to have a 100%, fully scheduled and expected, regularly repeatable chance to fight the monster. That's a major advantage over getting lucky enough to stumble upon a world pop version, get claim and have enough people to take it down.

People like World Pop NMs, despite the problems that come with them. But people also want the items these NM's drop without having to worry about getting out-claimed by botters and cheaters. Ideally, the best way to deal with this situation is to find some sort of middle ground that appeases both groups. So by making World Spawn NMs that act like Ix and SW (which everyone says they're a pain in the ass to camp, as they should be) with relatively high drop rates (rewards for organizing and claiming the mob before other groups) while at the same time offering similarly difficult repeatable Leve versions of the mobs with the same exact loot pools for people who feel they can kill it but don't want to camp and claim, you can appease just about everyone. People who want world pop NMs get their world pop NMs, people who just want the fight or the gear can get the fight and the gear, and everyone but the smallest percentage of players is left happy as almost everyone gets their way.

[orson]

Um... Ya, that's why I said the majority of kings drops. Not only that, Ridill wasn't really a big must have after the 2-handed update which coincided fairly close with Einherjar being introduced. As for defending ring I'll give you that but I'm not sure what your point is. The reason many LSs kept doing kings was to sell drops if you don't believe me, ask around.

For the majority of players AKA anyone who works and/or goes to school, kings and stuff like DI + SW blow. It's far better to be able to say, "oh hey LS we're going to do DI at 6:00 pm EST," rather than "you need to camp this monster until 3 am EST even though you have class in the morning or you don't get gear." Which is more stressful? Which is an unhealthy practice? Competing can be fun if it's tempered reasonably, but they weren't. Even you're saying, [quote]which everyone says they're a pain in the ass to camp, as they should be.[quote] So basically you're saying the less fun the game gets the more rewarding it should be? What sort of twisted logic is that?

If you make the drop rates on world bosses better than instanced versions then you're basically forcing a lot of serious players to be stuck doing them. Hell even putting equal drop rates on a restricted timer instance and a world boss forces players to do the world boss. There's no real choice there, you want the best gear you spend hrs and hrs doing virtual BS hunting or you're gimp. Only the smallest % of players actually enjoyed camping kings. You're somewhat deluded or had really weird friends if they kept saying they liked that shit for more than a year. The majority of players hated that shit but stuck with it so long because the gear was simply, "the best." I hate to use it as example because it still has huge flaws as well but this is one of the biggest reasons WoW stomped the shit out of FFXI in terms of player base. World spawns and putting the best gear on them is a terrible idea that will never be popular with the majority of players. It's bad business to cater to the minority of your players.

[miokomioko]

Honest question since I stopped giving a shit about kings/wyrms/etc. a long time ago. If almost none of the drops from these HNMs were must-haves or top-notch shit starting a year or two ago, who the hell was buying them for prices worth camping?