FFXIV Flame Wars Thread: because ten threads is not enough threads

[Elrina]

Holy shit, there was so much fucking win on the lodestone this morning. I just picked my favorite quote. But since this is the flame thread and all......... WHAT DO U FUCKING HATERS HAVE TO SAY NOW!!!!11

That this is exactly what we've been bitching that we wanted. :3

4.0

Rofl

[Hyan]

But this is still fluff, nothing more.

Except the free trial period extension of course. Nice.

[CasualPlayer]

But this is still fluff, nothing more.

Except the free trial period extension of course. Nice.

How is this fluff? Wtf do u want se to do or say?

[Patriarch]

"Considering the nature of much of the feedback we received, however, and the current state of the game, we have decided to extend the free trial period for all users."

"We humbly ask for your continued support to this end."

Who thinks they genuinely care?

[Hyan]

"Considering the nature of much of the feedback we received, however, and the current state of the game, we have decided to extend the free trial period for all users."

"We humbly ask for your continued support to this end."

Who thinks they genuinely care?

How much money did they just lose there? Can't think of a better way to say "we care" lol

How is this fluff? Wtf do u want se to do or say?

Nothing changed in-game. Fluff. But hey, I'll take it.

[Elrina]

But this is still fluff, nothing more.

Except the free trial period extension of course. Nice.

Irrelevant. Fluff or not, it's easy to see that people are excited over this. Excited = good.

[Dooom]

But since this is the flame thread and all......... WHAT DO U FUCKING HATERS HAVE TO SAY NOW!!!!11

Lack of Auction House. Has delivery options been mentioned?

[Hyan]

Irrelevant. Fluff or not, it's easy to see that people are excited over this. Excited = good.

More like skeptical. "Well they said this, but it's SE, I'll believe when I see it blahblah"

[CasualPlayer]

Lack of Auction House. Has delivery options been mentioned?

Explain to me the difference between retainers with a search function (with a bell over them indicating theyre selling the item your searching for even) and an AH? Honestly this makes the most since considering all the +1-3 for everything in the game.

[CasualPlayer]

Edit: didn't see your previous post Hyan.

But on that account the changes they're talking about implementing could hardly be done over night. Don't think u can call it fluff until December when they actually implement them or not.

My definition is different than yours though I guess to each his own.

[Dooom]

AH puts everything there in front of you. Retainer search is still going to involve running around wasting more time. It also depends how they implement search. Ward specific? Can you browse through a list of what's on sale?

[Hyan]

So its "fluff" because u think SE is lying about everything? Got it.

It's fluff because nothing in-game changed.

[Elrina]

Explain to me the difference between retainers with a search function (with a bell over them indicating theyre selling the item your searching for even) and an AH? Honestly this makes the most since considering all the +1-3 for everything in the game.

Search feature to allow item searches by individual wards
Icon display to identify retainers selling sought-after items
Increase in the number of retainers that may be employed

Unless I'm reading that incorrectly, we'll still be limited to searching by the specific ward for things. By making that restriction, they may also limit us to searching for things in that ward that belong in that ward. Or not, maybe they'll let us make blanket searches across all the wards, and no matter which ward it's located the icon will show up for it. Still involves a lot of extra work compared to a central game wide AH that you can access from each city.

Maybe they'll give us retainers for in-game currency, or maybe they'll charge us $1/month per additional retainer we want. (Keep in mind that it's not just about selling things across wards either, it's inventory management.)

This will help, and a lot of the update notes are pretty stellar, but an AH is still pretty vital sooner or later.

[el_tio]

I'm happy to see the glimpses of a new SE customer relations vision progressing. Baby steps. It's still not the daily/weekly massaging of the playerbase that Blizz does but it's radically improved from my experiences with FFXI.

It's fluff because nothing in-game changed.

Seems like you're going for deep quantum uncertainty in general. It's not a bad approach but I prefer the uncertainty that says that what I don't know / experience directly I don't know instead of saying that what I don't know doesn't exist.

[Decillion]

I'm glad SE finally admitted that they released the beta version of the game and are now trying to make it up to the few people they have left who care about the game. But, what I want to know is why didn't they just delay the game until December when all of this content would be ready for release? Were they really that strapped for cash that they needed to rush the game out this early and cause so much damage to both the game's image, and the Final Fantasy brand in general?

Also, maybe reading it wrong, but it sounds like a lot of the really simple fixes won't be implemented until the Nov/Dec content patches. People still playing the game shouldn't have to wait a month, or more, for stuff like <pos>, a decent crtl + r, re-mappable keys, anima adjustments, monster placement, etc... Simple stuff like that should be patched in as soon as it's ready, instead of saving it all for a giant content patch.

[Elcura]

I'm glad SE finally admitted that they released the beta version of the game and are now trying to make it up to the few people they have left who care about the game. But, what I want to know is why didn't they just delay the game until December when all of this content would be ready for release? Were they really that strapped for cash that they needed to rush the game out this early and cause so much damage to both the game's image, and the Final Fantasy brand in general?

Also, maybe reading it wrong, but it sounds like a lot of the really simple fixes won't be implemented until the Nov/Dec content patches. People still playing the game shouldn't have to wait a month, or more, for stuff like <pos>, a decent crtl + r, re-mappable keys, anima adjustments, monster placement, etc... Simple stuff like that should be patched in as soon as it's ready, instead of saving it all for a giant content patch.

I don't think they've actually admitted to this being a "beta version", even if it is true, they'll never say it. And we've been through why they didn't delay the game, though considering how long they've given everyone to play for free, they might as well have.

And the reason the updates might not be coming out now, is because they're probably not ready. But despite the delay in getting these features, they are still coming. Can we move onto the next thing to bitch about, which I suspect will be AH vs Market Wards.

[Lucavi]

ArenaNet shareholders understand that if you release a game with no proper content patches and most of the money comes from copies sold, it's gotta be ready by the release and not after.

Everything they've said so far indicates that this game, like GW1, will have short term appeal and nothing more. Or should I say, slightly longer appeal than GW1. It doesn't even have to have the long term appeal that proper MMO's need to be successful.

Once again, it's not a replacement.

This is actually somewhat true, given that GW follows not a monthly payment system, but a purchased expansion system. I don't know how accurate Hyan is when he predicts the future in saying that GW will only have short term; its should be more accurately that they only "have" to have short term appeal. Keep the consumer locked in and engaged for around 4-7 months, and by then, you're already releasing teasers for the next expansion, and have pushed out one or two fix patches for the current expansion. You hook the players with the next expansion, and the money arrives in large chunks, not smooth streams like traditional MMOs.

I'm not going to predict that GW will be boring in a few months because as long as you have players around to shape content, a game is only as boring as you allow it to become. Fuck, I played Dungeon Siege online for well over a year without it ever becoming boring to me, and its almost like a poor man's version of GW. The online portion literally had no content out of having 8 people beat the shit out of things and dungeon crawl, and it was still fun a year later because of *gasp* the people.

I don't think the difference "term-wise" varies tremendously from traditional MMOs like FFXIV and hybrids like GW, as it's certainly possible to burn out from a game like FFXI in a short matter of months, especially if you plow to end-game and then hit a wall of progression due to hackers/cheaters/HNM drama, but there is certainly a difference on perhaps how the companies behind the games shape them, due to the pay model. GW can focus mainly on building up hype for the next X-pac, while games like XI had to try to retain tons of subs throughout the duration of an expansion, as well as drum up sales for the next one.

[Enedin]

I'm hoping Japan doesn't do the same thing they did with FFXIII, which is tell SE they made a perfect game. FFXIII was 7/10 tops, not 39/40. I really hope Japan realizes their mighty SE isn't flawless, that would at least get some SE execs thinking. I hope.

I so want to be able to read JP in a few weeks. I want to feel the pain they feel when writing their reviews.

[Lucavi]

I'm glad SE finally admitted that they released the beta version of the game and are now trying to make it up to the few people they have left who care about the game. But, what I want to know is why didn't they just delay the game until December when all of this content would be ready for release? Were they really that strapped for cash that they needed to rush the game out this early and cause so much damage to both the game's image, and the Final Fantasy brand in general?

Also, maybe reading it wrong, but it sounds like a lot of the really simple fixes won't be implemented until the Nov/Dec content patches. People still playing the game shouldn't have to wait a month, or more, for stuff like <pos>, a decent crtl + r, re-mappable keys, anima adjustments, monster placement, etc... Simple stuff like that should be patched in as soon as it's ready, instead of saving it all for a giant content patch.

Shareholder pressure, pressure from Development heads, pressure to "beat" other MMO launches (Read; Cata). There are a number of reasons. SE didn't do anything th at 30 other MMOs didn't do before them. Its just the way things work these days, it seems.

Step 1: Develop game.
Step 2: Find out the estimated time that WoW's newest expansion comes out.
Step 3: Succumb to outside/top pressure to push the game out to "beat" the competition to the market.
Step 4: Attempt to disagree, citing quality concerns, but concede after rebuffs.
Step 5: Tentatively push the game out early, paying your PR team overtime to smooth things over.
Step 6: When the inevitable backlash hits, attempt damage control.
Step 7: Slowly implement changes and hope to weather the storm.

You can file just about every new MMO since 2006 under this "tried and true" 7-step method to mediocrity. Some games manage to tread water, while others fold. Others manage to gain headway and become true "niche" games. All probably would have fared better by taking their time, ignoring WoW, and trying to move to the beat of their own drum, but when the money pushes you around, you have to take it.

[Meko]

I agree with Lucavi. Regardless of any pressures, just work on the game and put out a quality product. I'm happy to see them making adjustments and listening. Of course, all of this is still up in the air until it actually hits the servers so I'm going to lay back and see how things play out.