777 Crashes in San Francisco

[AidenCarby]

http://www.cnn.com/

A Boeing 777 bound from South Korea crashed Saturday upon landing at San Francisco International Airport, sending up a huge fireball and spinning before finally coming to a stop -- having lost its tail and, eventually, much of its charred roof.

[6souls]

A Boeing 777 bound from South Korea crashed Saturday upon landing at San Francisco International Airport, sending up a huge fireball and spinning before finally coming to a stop -- having lost its tail and, eventually, much of its charred roof.

Asiana Airlines Flight 214 left Seoul's Incheon International Airport earlier Saturday, according to FlightAware, a website that offers tracking services for private and commercial air traffic. An airline spokesman in Seoul told CNN that 291 passengers and 16 staff members were aboard.

At least 28 people hurt in the crash were being treated late Saturday afternoon at area hospitals -- 15 at San Francisco General Hospital, five at Stanford Hospital, five at California Pacific Medical Center's St. Luke's Campus and three at St. Francis Memorial Hospital -- hospital spokespeople said.

San Francisco General Hospital spokeswoman Rachel Kagan said that facility was expecting another 15 patients. At least 10 who were already in that hospital -- eight adults and two children -- were in critical condition. Tents have been set up outside the hospital's emergency department.

The U.S. Coast Guard has transported one person to Stanford Hospital, said Corrine Gaines of the military branch.

Air traffic control audio -- between the airport's tower and Flight 214 crew members -- suggested that those on the ground knew there was some sort of problem, promising that "emergency vehicles are responding."

"We have everyone on their way," the air traffic controller said, according to LiveATC.net, a website that provides air traffic control audio.

Anthony Castorani, who witnessed the flight land from a nearby hotel, said he saw the plane touch the ground then noticed a larger plume of white smoke.

"You heard a pop and you immediately saw a large, brief fireball that came from underneath the aircraft," he told CNN.

Kristina Stapchuck saw the dramatic scene unfold from her seat on a plane on the airport tarmac. Soon after Flight 214 touched down, "it looked like the tires slipped a little bit and it rocked back," she told CNN.

Parts of the plane began to break off as it rocked and then began to spin.

"It all happened so suddenly," Stapchuck told CNN.

A photo provided to CNN by Eunice Bird Rah -- and shot by her father, who was a passenger on the plane -- shows flames and smoke bursting out of many of the aircraft's windows.

Rah's father knew something bad was coming, he told his daughter, telling her the plane was coming in too low and the pilot tried to raise it at the last minute. Rah said her father "is doing fine, thank God," but noted that others appeared to be hurt.

Said Rah: "It's heartbreaking."

Video taken soon after the crash and posted on YouTube showed dark gray smoke rising from the plane, which appeared to be upright. That smoke later became white, even as fire crews continued to douse the plane.

CNN iReporter Timothy Clark was on an eighth-floor balcony of a nearby hotel when he heard the noise and saw a "dust cloud."

"Then people running from the plane, then flames," Clark said.

A photograph posted to Twitter shows what appear to be passengers walking off the plane, some of them toting bags, as smoke rises from the other side.

"I just crash landed at SFO," read the accompanying message from David Eun. "Tail ripped off. Most everyone seems fine. I'm ok. Surreal..."

The top of the aircraft was charred and, in spots, gone entirely, according to video from CNN affiliate KTVU. The plane was on its belly, with no landing gear evident and the rear tail of the plane gone.

Debris settled from the water's edge, along San Francisco Bay, up to where the plane eventually came to a stop.

Fire trucks were on site; first responders could be seen walking outside the aircraft.

Evacuation slides could be seen extending from one side of the aircraft, from which there was no apparent smoke.

According to Asiana Airlines, 141 of the passengers who were aboard Flight 214 are Chinese, 77 are South Korean and 61 are American.

Sheryl Sandberg, Facebook's chief operating officer and author of the book "Lean In," was supposed to be one of them, she wrote on her Facebook page. But she'd switched instead to a United flight, arriving about 20 minutes before the Asiana flight crashed.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/06/us/cal...ent/index.html

There are also 60 unaccounted for, but apparently some people walked away from the crash without waiting for medical services.

[Mazmaz]

Thanks, Obama!

[Niiro]

There are also 60 unaccounted for, but apparently some people walked away from the crash without waiting for medical services.

Getting thru airport security normally is bad enough, I can't imagine what it would have been like after your plane crashed.

"shit now's our chance, tie off my stump we are not missing the game"

[Outlaw]

Doesn't belong in political section but anyway..

Video has surfaced of the crash:

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/07/us/asi...html?hpt=hp_t1

Also..

The captain of the flight that crashed in San Francisco International Airport had relatively little experience piloting Boeing 777s and had clocked up only 43 hours on the model, the airline said on Monday.

"It was Lee Kang-kuk's maiden flight to the airport with the jet," a spokeswoman for Asiana Airlines told Reuters. "He was in training. Even a veteran gets training (for a new jet)."

The plane was also flying “significantly below” its intended speed and its crew tried to stop the landing less than two seconds before it hit a seawall next to the runway, federal aviation inspectors said.

Two Chinese teenagers were killed in the incident and more than 180 people injured when Asiana Airlines Flight 214 crashed. Investigators were trying to determine whether pilot error, mechanical problems or something else was to blame for the crash.

While an experienced pilot, Asiana’s Lee Kang-kuk was under “transition training" to become fully qualified on a Boeing 777, according to an Asiana Airlines spokesperson.

The San Francisco flight was his ninth 777 flight, and he had clocked 43 hours on the model. Pilots must fly 60 hours and 10 landings to be considered a full Boeing 777 captain. Lee had done 9,700 hours on an A320, a Boeing 747 and Boeing 737. His copilot Lee Jung-min assisting him on the flight, had “considerable” Boeing 777 experience with more than 3,000 hours on the model, and a total of more than 10,000 hours, Asiana said.

Such a training process was a “very necessary process that happens around the world every day of the week,” said Adrian Gjertsen, an aviation consultant and director of U.K.-based Airsupport Aviation Services Limited. “What happens in a good responsible airline is that while the guy is training in one seat the other guy will be a training captain,” or a pilot who had been specifically trained to work with those in transition training, he added.

Gjertsen said he did not know whether Asiana required so-called training captains to fly with those in transition throughout the entire training process.

The head of the National Transportation Safety Board said Sunday that the pilots were flying too slowly as they approached the airport and tried to abort the landing but crashed only a second later.

“Why was the speed low? Don’t think you can speculate on why at this point (but) you shouldn’t be that low on approach to the point where the speed gets to a stick shaker activation,” Gjertsen said, referring to a piece of safety equipment that warns pilots of an impending stall.

“The engines are very big and have a lot of inertia,” he added. “That’s why you don’t want to go too much below your calculated speed. It is like setting off at the traffic lights in your car in fourth gear instead of first,” he said. “It takes you longer to accelerate if you move off in fourth.”

There was no evidence in the two recovered “black boxes” that the Boeing 777 was experiencing any problems before the crash, National Transportation Safety Board chief Deborah Hersman said at a Sunday news conference.

Hersman said investigators were also planning to conduct interviews with the pilots, the crew and passengers in order to reconstruct the events leading up to the dramatic event.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...-piloting-777s

and..

Also Sunday, San Mateo County Coroner Robert Foucrault said he was investigating whether one of the two teenage passengers killed Saturday actually survived the crash but was run over by a rescue vehicle rushing to aid victims fleeing the burning aircraft.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...-job-training/

[Cream Soda]

Holy fuck. My friend, Miae was in South Korea and due to be returning soon. I sure as fuck hope she wasn't on that flight, though I don't think she's supposed to be back yet, and I think she'll be flying into LAX over San Fran.

But this scares the shit out of me. Going to write her an email now

[Tajin]

Finally got some K-ass hooked on dat biceps?

My nig.

[Viq]

We had a 40 minute discussion about this in my Korean class this morning. Since over half the class is Chinese, they were spouting all kinds of ridiculous bullshit about how it's an American conspiracy that the only people who died were Chinese. I wanted to rage so hard, but there's a pretty stiff penalty against our final grade if we swear in class, and I couldn't think of a nicer way to phrase, "Are you fucking high right now?" other than, "You must be high as shit."

Also, they were saying that the Chinese media has already put 100% of the blame on the pilot before the blackbox info had come out. They were making it sound like the only other thing he had flown was a paper airplane. I didn't know that living in Korea would turn me racist against Chinese dudes, but I'm getting there.

[archibaldcrane]

It is fucking amazing that a plane, exploding into a fucking fireball on impact, only had 2 deaths out of over 400 people on board.

Unbelievable.

[Seraph]

It is fucking amazing that a plane, exploding into a fucking fireball on impact, only had 2 deaths out of over 400 people on board.

Unbelievable.

^ This right here. Completely serious.

[liggy 0]

There are also 60 unaccounted for, but apparently some people walked away from the crash without waiting for medical services.

heard on the radio that one of the survivors waiting for medical services got hit by a rescue vehicle, and died. if that's true, god must have really wanted him dead

[BaneTheBrawler]

It is fucking amazing that a plane, exploding into a fucking fireball on impact, only had 2 deaths out of over 400 people on board.

Unbelievable.

no kidding. any landing you can walk away from, etc.

heard on the radio that one of the survivors waiting for medical services got hit by a rescue vehicle, and died. if that's true, god must have really wanted him dead

that or darwin just didn't like him. i have a hunch this is gonna turn out to be because he ran out waving his arms like they can't see the huge pillar of smoke and shit.

[Buffy]

Rofl the guy was 1/2 done with training and the trainer was on his first training flight.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/09/us/asi...html?hpt=hp_t1

[Ddz]

In spite of all the negativity surrounding this, I have to bravo those Boeing engineers. Designing an airplane that can sustain that much abuse, the tail basically being ripped off, catch on fire, skid to ground and still have almost every single passenger be able to get away safely is unbelievable. This is why everyone should go study physics and math to make the world a better place.

[Tarage]

Don't forget that it threw an engine and exploded.

[Meresgi]

In spite of all the negativity surrounding this, I have to bravo those Boeing engineers. Designing an airplane that can sustain that much abuse, the tail basically being ripped off, catch on fire, skid to ground and still have almost every single passenger be able to get away safely is unbelievable. This is why everyone should go study physics and math to make the world a better place.

^ This seriously. At first I was like "fuck this, not getting on a plane again" but when you think about what COULD have happened if it was put together like shit. Freaking crazy

[Ksandra]

Just as sort of an update. I've been rather curious as to what caused the pilots to do what they did.

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The Asiana Airlines pilot who was flying the jetliner that crashed at San Francisco International Airport on Saturday told investigators that a flash of light temporarily blinded him 34 seconds before impact, federal investigators said Wednesday.

The pilot, who was making his first approach into the airport in a Boeing 777, told South Korean and American investigators that as the jetliner descended to 500 feet in altitude, something flashed in his eyes, said Deborah Hersman, chairwoman of the National Transportation Safety Board.

"We really don't know at this point what it could have been," Hersman said after a reporter at the news conference asked whether it could have been a laser. "We need to look into it. We need to understand what he's talking about. We may need to follow up with him."

Although the flash caused what Hersman described as only "a temporary issue," it occurred at about the same time the pilots realized the plane was flying too low and was not lined up correctly with the runway. They were working to realign the plane and didn't notice it had slowed down until it was too late, Hersman said. As the aircraft neared the runway, it almost stalled, struck the rocky seawall at the end of the tarmac and crashed.

Reports of lasers being flashed at pilots are not unusual, and in 2012, President Obama signed a law criminalizing the act of pointing a laser at a plane. FBI officials have called the problem epidemic.

The flash wasn't the only perplexing revelation. Hersman said the crew ordered the passengers to remain seated once the plane came to a stop, delaying the evacuation for 90 seconds.

A flight attendant had initially asked the pilots whether she should begin an evacuation, but Hersman said she was told not to, as the pilots were apparently still consulting with flight control. An announcement was then made over the intercom telling passengers to "stay in your seats," Hersman said.

A cabin manager in the middle of the airplane then noticed a fire outside the craft and asked a flight attendant to tell the crew. That's when the evacuation began, Hersman said.

"We don't know what the pilots were thinking," she said, adding that after crashes pilots sometimes wait for instructions from the control tower. "We certainly want to take a look at that. Hindsight is 20-20. We need to understand what they were thinking and what their procedures are" before making a judgment.
Additional details

The revelations were the latest in the crash of Flight 214, which left two 16-year-old girls dead and injured many of the other 305 people aboard the jetliner, including three who remained in critical condition Wednesday at San Francisco General Hospital.

Other details revealed by federal officials on Wednesday include:

-- Asiana pilots initially tried to contact San Francisco air traffic control at 2,000 feet but received no response. Pilots tried again at 1,000 feet and got a response. Hersman said that sometimes air traffic control does not respond because controllers are busy.

-- Two evacuation slides deployed inside the aircraft, each trapping a flight attendant, one of whom broke her leg, and forcing crew members to work frantically to free them as flames licked up into the cabin. "It is unknown at this time why the evacuation slides deployed inside the aircraft," Hersman said.

-- Three flight attendants who had been seated in the back of the plane were ejected - with their seats - from the aircraft when the tail section broke into pieces and the plane spun around on the runway. On Tuesday, federal officials said two flight attendants had been flung from the plane.

-- The NTSB investigators planned to begin salvaging and moving parts of the wreckage from the runway on Wednesday. They said they intended to return the runway to the control of SFO officials as early as Wednesday night but that the runway will need repairs before it can be put back into service.
Interviewing crew

Hersman said NTSB investigators have completed interviews with the four pilots and six of the 12 flight attendants who were on Flight 214. The other six flight attendants remain hospitalized and have not been interviewed.

Meanwhile, the six flight attendants who are not in the hospital arrived at the Airport Aviation Museum on Wednesday for a news conference. One of them, in a wheelchair with one leg bandaged and in a walking boot, broke down in tears and covered her face as dozens of cameras clicked. She and four others were quickly ushered away by airline officials.

"I hope for all the families who have suffered from this accident for a full recovery," the remaining attendant, Lee Yoon Hye, a cabin manager, said through an interpreter. "We Asiana flight attendants and personnel are working hard to recover as quickly as possible."

http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/articl...ed-4658043.php


At first, it sounds like a major , but then they said that shooting lasers at planes was an "epidemic." I've never heard of this before. How common is that?

[Pyro]

Lasers in the cockpit happens quite a bit. The Flight Operations groups are pretty serious about it and official reports are generated and every instance requires that the pilot and first officer have their eyes checked for any damage.

I wouldn't call it an epidemic though.

[archibaldcrane]

Probably a major - I wonder if the copilot backs up his claim. I highly doubt he took a laser to the face and didn't comment on it as they were coming in.

[Niiro]

They should make sunglasses especially for people who fly aircraft.

"Piloters" might be a good name.