For those of you who have me added to facebook

[Cream Soda]

Join in on the debate. Whities cant stand to the negro logic

grr can't post on her wall even though I was tagged. More infos below

[Knyghtmayre]

why is the background smiling in your avatar? also, no

[Blarg]

post the convo because I don't want to friend you

[Mizango]

Nothing to see, I cant see her wall.

[Cream Soda]

Basically, I'm saying if it's never ever a possibility for me to buy a movie, because I won't absolutely do it, then the company makes the exact same amount of money if I download the movie, watch the movie at a friend's house, or just plain don't watch it at all, but I'd never buy the movie under any circumstances.

[Blarg]

Well as long as you don't upload the movie then that's true.

[Blarg]

If you do any uploading like in torrents then you can indirectly be helping others take money away in the tiniest amount

[Cream Soda]

If you do any uploading like in torrents then you can indirectly be helping others take money away in the tiniest amount

Fuck that shit i don't seed lol.

[Cream Soda]

I'm on a slow enough stole connection as it is, don't need to further perpetuate that problem.

[Blarg]

what is this other person saying then

[Cream Soda]

That I'm still costing them money because i have to pay to see it >.>

"the fact that you're watching it without buyign it loses them money."
"they would rather have you not buy it and not watch it."

"omfg. you're insane. if you want to watch it, you have to buy it. whether or not you planned on buying it is irrelevant. If you decide to watch it, you have to buy it"

[Blarg]

make a buying shoes analogy so her female brain can understand

[Cream Soda]

Kk i have a challenger on her page lol.

Spoiler: show

Me:
In case anyone is wondering, we were having a debate as to whether my pirating of a movie costs the company or not.

Kassie's stance: If you watch the movie and don't pay for it, you are costing them money.

My stance: ... See More
Movie costs $20, they sell 10 copies

A) I purchase a copy, making 11 sales, totaling $220

B) I don't think the movie is worth purchasing, but I don't pirate it either, making 10 sales, totaling $200

C) I don't think the movie is worth buying, but I feel its worth pirating, making 10 sales, totaling $200.

My stance is that A isn't even a possibility here. I absolutely will not buy this movie, whether I pirate it, don't watch it at all, or watch at a friend's house who did buy it.

So, comparing B with C, Whether I pirate the movie or just plain not watch the movie with purchasing the movie never even being an option, the company makes the exact same amount of money. The only would make a different amount if I ever intended on buying it in the first place, which I did not.




Him:
The bottom line is you receive the benefit of the movie without paying for it. So while the movie company doesn't actually lose money because you wouldn't have bought anyway they still have to pay to make movies (that you watch) so they end up charging the rest of us more. So essentially all the rest of us who actually pay for movies are paying so you can watch it without paying. So no you're not costing them money. you're costing us money.


Me:
I cost you the same amount of money as if I had not watched the movie at all, though. No possible way I could cost you more money if my two choices were pirate the movie or not watch the movie at all.
Or we can say I go to a friend's house, who did buy the movie, and watch it there or borrow it from him instead of buying the movie. All would result in the same cost on your part.

Him:
If you paid for the movies you watched they would cost me less.

Me:
Yes, but paying isn't an option. My only two choices are pirate or don't watch at all. Under no circumstance am I going to pay. At best, if I didn't pirate a movie, I would find someone who did have the movie and borrow it from them.

My point that pirating would do the exact same as if I would borrow it from someone, not watch the movie at all... See More, or even watched it on youtube.

In our discussion, Kassie was saying that if I had went and watched it at a friend's house who did have it, that it would be different than if I just downloaded it.


Him:
If everyone pirated movies there would be no more movies. Everything else is just a matter of degree. So once again . . . when you enjoy the benefit of something without paying for it (or your friend paying for it) someone has to support that activity if it is going to continue. That someone is everyone else.


Me:
I think you're missing the point though, which is, if I did not pirate the film, or watch it at a friend's house, then I would not watch the film at all.

This is different from someone who was planning on buying the film but then pirates instead, because they were actually intending on giving their money to the company, but in my case I would ... See Morenot.

Let's say pirating did not exist. I would prefer not to watch the movie at all then. There are cheaper forms of entertainment and I would pick up one of those. So again, i hurt people the exact same amount as if I had decided not to watch the movie at all, because if pirating were not around, I sure would not be watching all these movies.


Him:
The fact that you would not watch the film is immaterial. You are watching it and I am paying for it.
Using your logic stealing ANYTHING is ok if you wouldn't be using it if you hadn't stolen it. Let's just take your first Paragraph and replace film with car

I think you're missing the point though, which is, if I did not steal the car, or borrow it from a friend, then I would not drive the car at all.
... See More
Or shoplifting food

I think you're missing the point though, which is, if I did not steal the food, or eat it at a friend's house, then I would not eat the food at all.

Just because you wouldn't use something if you didn't steal it doesn't make it ok to steal it


Me:
Your example doesn't apply here though. Let's say I steal a car or shoplift food. That car is gone, and so is the food. We can even use the DVD as an example. If I go into the store and steal a DVD that is a DVD they cannot sell. If I download a duplicated file, nothing disappears, and there is nothing that cannot be sold as a result of my downloading it.

It isn't a fair or proper comparison with something that has limited supply and something in which there is infinite supply.

Let's go with your car example. My two choices are steal a car or walk. i will absolutely not purchase a car. If I steal a car, this is a physical car that is gone. It was somebody's car. If I had never purchased a car or if I stole a car, there is actually a difference in the amount earned now, unlike my earlier example with the amount earned if I had not watched the movie at all or if I watched it at a friend's house.... See More

Now, to reinforce my stance on this. I'm not saying it isn't stealing. I'm not saying it's right. I'm not saying it's legal. I'm saying I cause the exact same damage as someone who chooses not to watch the movie at all. This is not the same case with the car, as if I steal one off the lot.

Movie: Money not earned vs money not earned
Car: Money not earned (me not buying it) vs money in the red (the car that is now missing and they have to replace).

[Blarg]

For a dude who shits on floors I am surprised you are the correct one here

[Cream Soda]

lol, took him 17 mins to come up w/ this one.

Before he was replying in 1-2 mins

There's effectively not really a limited supply of cars or food so if you steal a car from a car lot or food from a grocery store no one does without. At least not in the United States. The reason stealing from businesses is bad isn't because someone does without it's because when someone steals the rest of us have to pay more to make up for it... See More.

The reason the comparison is valid is because it costs money to make those things just like it costs money to make movies. All the rest of us are "chipping in" so the movie company can continue to make movies. You're not. So once again you enjoy the movies and the rest of us pay for them.
The fact that you wouldn't watch if you didn't steal doesn't matter you are watching and everyone else is paying for you to watch.

[Blarg]

this guy is a bundle of logic, I would stay away, you are in over your head

[Cream Soda]

Just replied to him

I'm not saying that nobody goes without. I'm saying that if I steal that car or food, that is a car or food that has to be replaced.

Let's say Ford has 10 Focus' on their lot. Each costing $15,000.

Scenario A) I don't have a car, won't steal one. The 10 Focus' sell. Ford makes $150,000.... See More

Scenario B) I don't have a car, I will steal one. 9 Focus' sell, I steal one. Ford makes $135,000.

Sure, ford can go replace that car, and it may fit your words "no one does without", but Ford is still out $15,000 from if I had not stole the car because that car is physically gone and they can no longer sell it.

Now let's go back to the movie I want to download.

I am Legend sells for $15, 10 copies are sold.

Scenario A) I don't buy the movie, I don't pirate the movie. Company makes $150

Scenario B) I don't buy the movie, I pirate the movie. Company makes $150

Scenario C) I physically walk into the store and steal a copy. Company makes $135.

In scenario C, the company is now physically out money, but I'm not doing scenario C, I do scenario B, the company is out nothing AS COMPARED to when I don't watch the movie at all.

As you can see, this is different from your car scenario, which is why it is invalid. Stealing a car and pirating a movie are NOT the same thing.

"So once again you enjoy the movies and the rest of us pay for them. "

Let's say 100 people buy this movie and 100 people watch this movie. Now let's say 100 people buy this movie and 101 watch this movie, the one being me. Whether I pirate it or do not watch it all, you all spend the exact same amount, $1,500. I do not cost you a dime.

But, going back to what you said earlier, if I watch the movie at a friend's house, that is the same right, leeching off of others?

So let me ask you this. If you buy a movie, and have a family of 5. Do you purchase 5 copies of the same movie, or do 5 people watch it for the price of the one you purchased? How is me watching the movie at a friend's house any different?

[Kaliden]

I think you won.

[Kaliden]

FINISH HIM/HER/THEM

[Cream Soda]

For a dude who shits on floors I am surprised you are the correct one here

I brainstorm when I shit on the floor.