I need that picture

[Senoska]

That is like talking about socialized shit like the fuzz, the internet being discovered by government peoples, nasa being funded by the government, etc. And then the punchline is "But health care is totally socialism" or some shit.

10 points for a quick reply.

[Cantih]

[Senoska]

<3. Need to own some conservative family members on facebook bitching about healthcare for three weeks straight. Thanks, babe.

[Shiroikage]

i'm sure they'll give a shit

[Senoska]

They gave a shit. I typed it out as a reply to one of their messages and got like a book in return..

[Senoska]

Just one post that was a reply:

No one forces you to use an alarm clock, automobile, TV, an OSHA/UL approved house, or Al-gore-invented internet. You choose to live this lifestyle, like the rest of us, and we (all) pay for things when we need or want them. I am not told HOW MUCH electricity to use each day, how many miles to drive, how many facebook posts to leave (thank goodness), and on and on and on.

To have a tax burden placed on Americans (even though some Americans may not have an income) is unprecedented. I didn't choose to be alive, I just am. I shouldn't have to pay into something merely because I exist, and no one is going to convince me otherwise. That is my paramount problem with the bill, and hopefully it will be overturned on the basis of unconstitutionality, for this serious violation alone.

Here's also what's wrong with the bill, from my perspective (the solutions to some of them may be obvious.)... See More

1. There is no mention of limiting malpractice awards in this bill. This, and the insurance that hospitals have to purchase to protect against malpractice suits are the two main reasons why healthcare services are so expensive. Solution? LIMIT THEM.

2. Nothing is being done to encourage people to be responsible with their medical care. Now that we have this "system" in place, people will be more likely to fall back on doctors when they don't even need to. Solution? More accountability in the doctor's office. When someone comes into the doctor's office when there is nothing wrong with them, make them foot half or more of the bill. That will "encourage" them to be better about crying wolf less often.

3. There is nothing in this bill about encouraging doctors and patients to use generics instead of the more expensive name-brand prescriptions. This solution is self explanatory.

4. Mandating that people buy something only creates less potential for competition, and has the potential to create more monopolies, driving prices up. This is simple economics. You can't think of healthcare as a utility, because it is FORCED upon us now. Remember, I can choose to turn off my TV (conserve electricity), not drive my car on the roads (ride a bike on the dirt.) This bill FORCES something upon us all. Prices ultimately go up.

5. There are no penalties for people who use tobacco, alcohol, or other harmful substances in quanties in their body. This bill actually encourages people to keep their bad habits and bad lifestyles. Despicable.

6. There is nothing in this bill that encourages the use of less expensive medical procedures instead of the outrageously priced CAT and MRI scans. These expensive machines need to be more tightly regulated, and only used when absolutely necessary. It seems right now it is pretty routine to get one of them, even with a slight head injury.

7. No competition across state lines. Why in the heck can't we get this turned on?

8. What do you think is going to happen when every small business in the country employing more than 50 people is going to have to provide insurance to all their employees? Businesses don't care about their employees. They care about surviving. At the end of the day, it domes down to simple numbers: higher costs mean more layoffs and/or higher prices. This bill is going to create more unemployment and raise the price of every single commodity in the entire country. I predict a doubling of the prices in the restaurant industry by 2014 (unless the bill is repealed).

9. Finally, there is nothing in the bill which helps people take better care of their bodies. No mention of preventative care such as healthy eating habits or recommended excercise routines. This bill is the ULTIMATE ENABLER of Americans with problematic lifestyles. 19 minutes ago

[Lyn]

I wish you could talk to my friend's mom without possibly losing the friendship I have with her. Her entire facebook is pretty much dedicated to posting links and complaining about all this shit.

[Senoska]

http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90682

You have no idea, lol.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y15...no60/jesse.jpg

http://senotaru.com/uploads/images/bradKasandra.jpg

They pretty much sit around and circle jerk about fox news and how bad Obama is.

[Lyn]

http://i39.tinypic.com/5wl36b.png

[Senoska]

^'
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[Zalius]

old people are so fucking stupid

[Senoska]

The problem is, with my family at least, is everyone is really young. All my cousins / uncles on my moms side are my age. Most are really crazy, only 1-2 sane ones. They have $$$ though and they think Obama is going to take it all away.

[Norellicus]

You should agree with them and tell them to give it to you for safekeeping

[Callisto]

I can deal with retarded conservatives yelling socialism at every act Brobama tries to take, but using facebook is not fucking cool

[Norellicus]

I can deal with retarded conservatives yelling socialism at every act Brobama tries to take, but using facebook is not fucking cool

I unfriended a couple of people because I got tired of seeing their batshit crazy commentary and didn't want the shitstorm that would inevitably ensue when I posted my opinions on a few things (not necessarily healthcare related, just Obama in general) lol

[Norellicus]

All Texans, of course

[Callisto]

I unfriended a couple of people because I got tired of seeing their batshit crazy commentary and didn't want the shitstorm that would inevitably ensue when I posted my opinions on a few things (not necessarily healthcare related, just Obama in general) lol

I more meant like anyone using facebook, ever

[Weeks]

For your dumb Facebook friend.

1. There is no mention of limiting malpractice awards in this bill. This, and the insurance that hospitals have to purchase to protect against malpractice suits are the two main reasons why healthcare services are so expensive. Solution? LIMIT THEM.

Much as I dislike cover-your-ass medicine and agree that it drives the cost of healthcare up, tort reform has been utterly ineffective in undoing this. You want to control costs, we need to set and enforce rigid standards of care and stop helping drug companies force new drugs through to market before either their efficacy or safety has been adequately proven.

2. Nothing is being done to encourage people to be responsible with their medical care. Now that we have this "system" in place, people will be more likely to fall back on doctors when they don't even need to. Solution? More accountability in the doctor's office. When someone comes into the doctor's office when there is nothing wrong with them, make them foot half or more of the bill. That will "encourage" them to be better about crying wolf less often.

This is not a big problem. Apart from the little old ladies who come for a friendly chat with their best friend Dr. ________ every few weeks, abuse of the doctor's office isn't a real problem. Abuse of the ER is a major one. In theory this bill helps that by rerouting them to the PCPs they'll have better access to, though I'm a cynic who tends to think ER abuse is a symptom more of personality disorder than lack of access.

3. There is nothing in this bill about encouraging doctors and patients to use generics instead of the more expensive name-brand prescriptions. This solution is self explanatory.

Yep, and it got dropped from the bill around day 1 to appease conservatives. Not to let the Democrats off the hook entirely, as they are nearly as much in big pharma's pocket as the Republicans.

4. Mandating that people buy something only creates less potential for competition, and has the potential to create more monopolies, driving prices up. This is simple economics. You can't think of healthcare as a utility, because it is FORCED upon us now. Remember, I can choose to turn off my TV (conserve electricity), not drive my car on the roads (ride a bike on the dirt.) This bill FORCES something upon us all. Prices ultimately go up.

Drop for a second the logical inconsistency that this bill creates several "monopolies" in the same industry. This healthcare bill has been designed to control costs from the start by providing access to preventive care. Admittedly preventive medicine is still not always more cost-effective, but recommendations are constantly being studied and tweaked to make it so. Seeing as 100% of the healthcare costs in this country are already being paid by anyone paying into private insurance or government-run plans, or the rare private payer, spreading the cost out over the entire tax base lowers costs.

5. There are no penalties for people who use tobacco, alcohol, or other harmful substances in quanties in their body. This bill actually encourages people to keep their bad habits and bad lifestyles. Despicable.

Huh? How, exactly? Are wavering people really going to take up smoking, secure in the knowledge that their new doctor will remove the lobes of their lungs licketty-split the second they detect cancer? This is a serious argument?

6. There is nothing in this bill that encourages the use of less expensive medical procedures instead of the outrageously priced CAT and MRI scans. These expensive machines need to be more tightly regulated, and only used when absolutely necessary. It seems right now it is pretty routine to get one of them, even with a slight head injury.

A sizable component of point 1. They don't need to be tightly regulated at all, but physicians do need enough confidence in the standards of care to make a clinical judgment and stick by it.

7. No competition across state lines. Why in the heck can't we get this turned on?

Because insurance companies go out of their way not to pay for medical care, and will all immediately set up shop in whichever state is most willing to not regulate them as they sell a worthless service. They have to deal with regulators in each state now, and only 60% of their revenue actually goes towards paying for healthcare. What does that number drop to when regulation vanishes?

8. What do you think is going to happen when every small business in the country employing more than 50 people is going to have to provide insurance to all their employees? Businesses don't care about their employees. They care about surviving. At the end of the day, it domes down to simple numbers: higher costs mean more layoffs and/or higher prices. This bill is going to create more unemployment and raise the price of every single commodity in the entire country. I predict a doubling of the prices in the restaurant industry by 2014 (unless the bill is repealed).

A real problem for businesses who employ people too stupid to realize that 1) they're not immortal, or 2) trading $700 in salary for $1400 in benefits, with the rest paid for by tax credits, is a good deal.

9. Finally, there is nothing in the bill which helps people take better care of their bodies. No mention of preventative care such as healthy eating habits or recommended excercise routines. This bill is the ULTIMATE ENABLER of Americans with problematic lifestyles. 19 minutes ago

Again, I want to meet the person who is holding off on the urge to scarf down that box of Twinkies until he has a doctor he can go to. It's simple: These people now get established at a doctor's office, who will nag them incessantly about smoking/drinking/exercise/diet. 99% of them will ignore it, but they were going to do this crap to themselves anyway. Now we just hopefully catch their diabetes/COPD/cirrhosis before they have damaged their bodies so severely that the government spends thousands upon thousands of dollars keeping them alive each year.

[quannum]

lol, look at that. he tried to combat that shit with a reasoned argument. lolololol

[Callisto]

Hint: not everyone who would like to go to the doctor but has no insurance takes terrible care of themselves. I've been stuck as a temp for the majority of my professional career because I attempted to fund my own education and got buried in school loan debt before I could finish my degree.

Now I can't get a reasonably-paying permanent job with benefits because I have no degree, and can't buy my own insurance or finish schooling because I can't get a reasonable job. I've dislocated fingers that I've popped back into place and dealt with, I've pulled my own tooth because I couldn't afford the dental work, I've been coughing up random shit daily despite quitting smoking years ago and taking better care of myself. I have various other medical issues that I'd not get into on here, and I can't do shit about it but hope that it fixes itself.

Yet aside from spans where I can't find a job I work, I pay taxes, I dump the same money into systems like medicare and social security that probably won't even still be around when I'm old enough to need them myself. I for one am ecstatic at the thought of maybe being able to see a doctor one day without having to dump two month's rent on them telling me to go home and drink lots of fluids until it stops.