New Car Buying

[aru]

hey guys,was hoping to get some opinions/advise on this.
i've been thinking about buying a new car for a few months now, not very seriously, but just a thought. recently, my current car has been having a string of problems with it ranging from the tires not holding air to transmittion and engine problems to brake failures... so now i think it's about time to dump it and move on since i feel that i'm doing nothing but pissing money away on mechanic bills. only problem is that i've never bought a new car before (current car was a gift) and i'm a bit overwhelmed at all of the things that need to be considered.

i'm a commuter, i drive about 100mi every other day for work round trip(i carpool with someone from work) and slightly more when i need to go on site visits so i was considering buying a hybrid car. after doing some research on what's out there, i'm focusing on a civic for now. does anyone currently own this car? what do you think of it? what made you buy it over a prius? i was also considering the prius but since just about all of the reviews out there say that the two are practically equal and since, in my opinion, the prius looks funny and doesnt drive as well i'm leaning towards the honda for now.

i was considering going for a 2008 model but suprisingly two of the dealerships that i contacted have said that they are completely out of stock/are very hard to get ahold of, that demand was very high and that they even have a waiting list set up for the 2009 models. they both quoted me for around 25,800 for the '09. this suprised me since MSRP, according to edmunds.com, is listed at 24,750. this is the first time i've ever heard of a dealer quote for over 1,000 over MSRP. edmunds' database shows, though, that this car, on average, is selling for 25,900 which, i suppose, cooberates what the dealers are telling me. But, I also got quoted at carsdirect.com for 24,700... does anyone have any experience with buying cars online? Nobody i know has any experience with carsdirect or any online car buying website for that matter. should i try to talk the physical location dealers down to their price or should i try to work with the online dealer that isn't trying to price gouge their initial quote?

[tyven]

buy american and save a job

[SephYuyX]

Dont buy new, buy a new used, and buy foreign, we make shitty cars in the US.

[Isiolia]

they both quoted me for around 25,800 for the '09. this suprised me since MSRP, according to edmunds.com, is listed at 24,750. this is the first time i've ever heard of a dealer quote for over 1,000 over MSRP. edmunds' database shows, though, that this car, on average, is selling for 25,900 which, i suppose, cooberates what the dealers are telling me. But, I also got quoted at carsdirect.com for 24,700... does anyone have any experience with buying cars online? Nobody i know has any experience with carsdirect or any online car buying website for that matter. should i try to talk the physical location dealers down to their price or should i try to work with the online dealer that isn't trying to price gouge their initial quote?

KBB n' Edmunds and all have their values, but MSRP or average value or whatever is not necessarily what a car costs in your specific area. If the demand is high, and people are paying more, then it'll cost more. That simple. Typically, with the kinds of cars you mentioned, you aren't going to get a great deal on them. Think about releases of stuff like the New Beetle or the Mini, where people regularly paid well over list for one.

It's like anything else, if you won't pay $25,000 for it, but the guy in line behind you will, then the dealership has no incentive to mark it down for you. Given the current economy most places would be falling all over themselves to sell you car...if you want a good deal, maybe explore some other makes/models.

I've helped with selling cars online before, but premium used (BMW, Porsche, etc), and transport isn't necessarily cheap either. So depends on how they're shipping the car out I guess.
Also, you can try contacting a dealership via their website. Often you have different salespeople handling online, and they may be authorized to offer you a more competitive (for online) price. Perhaps not for the models you mentioned, but as a general thing.

[aurik]

Fuck saving US jobs, also 100mi a day is pretty harsh, have you considered public high speed transit?

Also any dealership telling you demand is high is just buttering you up. Demand is in the shitter and nobody can get credit these days.

[Isiolia]

Also any dealership telling you demand is high is just buttering you up. Demand is in the shitter and nobody can get credit these days.

Ehhh, for cars in general, I'd say this is true. When you're talking specifically about cheap(er), fuel efficient cars though, with the gas price fluctuations...they've been a hot ticket for a while now, and demand is probably still quite high.

[Eliseos]

If you're going to want a new car, I'd say look in to leasing options. Go for a 3 year term at the max. If you take longer, you run the risk of owing more to your lease than your car is actually worth. If you decide to ever buy or lease another vehicle, your payments will be even higher on the next vehicle due to the buyout.

Honestly, either the Mazda3 or Volkswagen TDI Jettas are very affordable and both get great gas mileage. The TDI is a Diesel, but it gets upwards of 40MPG usually. It set the Guiness book of records at I think 50 something MPG.

I also work at a VW/Mazda dealer, so I'll be a little biased of them, but the Mazda3 is the car I'm looking at right now when I decide to get a new car.

[Dimmauk]

Dont buy new, buy a new used, and buy foreign, we make shitty cars in the US.

Most of the foreign cars we buy in America are made in America.

[Elesirdur]

Anything from either Honda or Toyota will retain a good resale price over the next few years, especially with their fuel-efficient engines.

By tagging either the Prius or the Civic, I presume you're looking for a sedan and not a coupe or hatchback?

If you're looking for a fuel-efficient sedan, why not a VW Jetta TDI Diesel? VW's website says it gets 30/38 mpg city/hwy and the overall dust-to-dust environmental impact of a diesel is way, way lower than that of a hybrid (battery systems are not environmentally friendly in their production). It's in the same ~$25k price range as the higher model Civics and VW's certainly been known for their good build quality and reliability.

If you're not into getting a compact or sub-compact (like my Toyota Yaris RS, which I love), then diesel is most definitely the way to go for fuel efeciency and environmental sustainabity. Not to mention that turbo-diesl cars like that Jetta have great torque for highway driving. European car makers have latched onto diesels for years because of the effeciency they can derive from their engines - although performance is usually a resounding meh, but so is a 1.2L petrol engine - and they are nothing like the noisy or smelly Volvo diesels of yore. Seriously, try one out I think you would be surprised.

[Biggz]

Can get a an 08 honda fit fully loaded for like 15k. id advise against leasing to.

[SephYuyX]

Most of the foreign cars we buy in America are made in America.

You know what I mean >.>!

[Correction]

Most of the foreign cars we buy in America are assembled in America.

Fixed. They're manufactured and designed abroad, then simply put together by low-cost labor in the States.

And buying a new car from a dealership is a sucker's bargain unless you're very very rich and want something custom built. Used hybrids are indeed in very high demand but here's the unromantic truth, you can get just as much fuel efficiency at a lower cost of ownership from non-hybrid cars. Especially in your case, driving 100 miles averaging the speeds you need to maximize hybrid efficiency is not terribly realistic.

[Dimmauk]

You know what I mean >.>!

Yeah I did.

I've been thinking about buying a new car too. I wonder if any American companies are having sales.

[Correction]

I wonder if any American companies are having sales.

They are, but they're specifically excluding hybrids from those sales and financial incentives.

[aru]

buy american and save a job

who's job? both honda and toyota have auto plants in the US, that's one hell of a commute from Japan. Maybe if american automakers had better development in what i want out of a car i would certainly consider them, but i don't want a pickup or suv.

If the demand is high, and people are paying more, then it'll cost more.

while that certainly makes sense, i have never met anyone that paid more than the sticker price, let alone 1k above it. i was in the same understanding that Aurik is, due to the economy nobody is buying and demand is low. i was expecting deals, not markups. though, you do make a good point, Isiolia, that there would remain demand for the fuel efficient cars even in our tanking economy.

Also, you can try contacting a dealership via their website. Often you have different salespeople handling online, and they may be authorized to offer you a more competitive (for online) price. Perhaps not for the models you mentioned, but as a general thing.

unfortunatly, these are the online quotes from the dealerships.

Fuck saving US jobs, also 100mi a day is pretty harsh, have you considered public high speed transit?

closest train station is about 15-20 miles away (in the opposite direction) and the way the scheduling/ride times work out it would add at least another hour to my commute. i'm looking to move, but prices around the area i work aren't exactly cheap.

how have you helped with selling cars online before Isiolia? were you an online dealer?

Used hybrids are indeed in very high demand but here's the unromantic truth, you can get just as much fuel efficiency at a lower cost of ownership from non-hybrid cars.

can you expand on this? which cars are you talking about? keep in mind i dont want to go much smaller than the one's i'm currently looking at.

They are, but they're specifically excluding hybrids from those sales and financial incentives.

yea, finding that out now... also looks like i missed the boat on the hybrid tax rebates too

the VW TDI was something i simply didnt know about, i'll look into them, thanks for the heads up

[Saphirea]

For the 08 models, yes they're harder to get. I used to work at Toyota and I still have lots of friends there and talked to them today just too see how business was around their shop.

The demand is still high for the Prius and finding an '08 will be difficult, especially in areas where the HOV limit and tax credit still exist for hybrid cars.

After driving both, I too would go with the civic. I like the prius but man is it ugly. The civic just runs nicer.

As far as leasing, there are sometimes some good options for leasing, my 4Runner lease I got for .005 interest, no money down for 4 years.

[Eliseos]

I forgot to mention that in my area at least, if you buy a TDI Jetta, you get a $1300 tax credit.

[0ni0n]

get a sexy, fully electric, US made tesla roadster!

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/8...oadsterbg1.jpg

/though at a price around $120,000, it's probably out of your price range.
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/t...jpg/1/w552.png

[Avinor]

Hybrids save very little (if any) fuel on the highway, so you may want to consider getting a traditional model instead (I'm sure a 100mile commute is mostly highway). The money you save could probably be put to good use (and with hybrid demand still up the savings should be even greater). Some non-hybrid models also offer packages/trim lines designed to squeeze a bit more fuel efficiency out of their designs, primarily with slightly tweaked aerodynamics and low rolling resistance tires. Typically its a small loss in upper-limit performance for a small gain in mileage. I know the Cobalt offers it, but I wouldn't recommend a Cobalt specifically.

Ultimately a diesel would probably be your best bet, but theres still limited availability in the US. Like hybrids they carry a price premium and are less likely to be offered with incentives, but the gas savings would probably pile up faster with your long commutes.

[Anakron]

Hybrids save very little (if any) fuel on the highway, so you may want to consider getting a traditional model instead (I'm sure a 100mile commute is mostly highway).

This is not necessarily true, and depends on the hybrid system. Toyota's systems are largely optimized for city traffic, whereas Honda's are optimized for highway traffic. For example, the Prius' city MPG is actually higher than its highway MPG, but the Insight's highway MPG rating is higher than its city rating.

However, the general argument regarding cost of ownership is generally true. A Civic may run you maybe $16-20k whereas a Prius will cost $25k+, so you'll have to do your own math to see how long it'd take for the Prius to pay itself off (considering Civics are roughly 35 MPG and Prius 45 MPG, and taking into account any tax credits, etc.).

If you can wait until next year, you may want to look at the Honda Insight that'll be introduced then. It'll get you great highway mileage (roughly 60-70MPG) and it's supposed to be priced around $20k.