Subduer and Algol

[Trythison]

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/images/5/59/Subduer.jpg DPS: 11.48

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/images/8/8e/Algol.png DPS: 10.43


Question: Which is truly better? Have tests been done?

I believe the lower delay and crit rate make the Subduer superior. My friend believes (stacked with h.corazza) that the Triple Attack activates often enough to make it a viable alternative. I always thought consensus was that the Subduer was the superior weapon, even though the other is much shinier and can find water in a desert. Thank you for your time.

[Ryko]

The subduer is "better" but frankly no one's using a greatsword to top parsers >_> it's poorly designed to do so and should really just stay in the realm of skillchain compatibility for HNMs

[Trythison]

HNM use, making Light with SAMs and such. Came up when my friend was using the Algol in D.Xarc today before we clubbed DL to death.

[Bagel]

I'm no DRK, but it seems like if you want to do more dmg (and yet use a GSD) go for Subduer. If you want to occasionally get a fast spurt of TP or epeen triple proc WS, go Algol. Funny this topic coming up, I just got a lolgol today and was considering tossing my subduer.

[Volken]

Like they both said, who gives a shit if you're using Gsword anyways. I've had algol forever, but I still carry around a balmung for skillchains on HNM's. toss the ugly one.

[Tiernin]

and can find water in a desert.

I loled

[Loren]

A small point, but multi-attack traits have diminishing returns:
Going from 0% -> 3% Triple Attack rate will enhance your output by 6%
Going from 2.5% -> 5.5% Triple Attack rate will enchance your output by 5.7%

So there is no magical synergy between H.Corazza and Algol, and as far as I know, DRK prefer Hauberk anyway (I received my Corazza for THF because a DRK passed to me and wanted feet instead).

I'm guessing WS damage between the two swords is very similar, with the Atk+3 and Triple procs giving a tiny advantage to Algol. Subduer looks superior for DoT unless Algol fire damage is really good. If we're talking HNM, critical hits are very significant (can do 5-10x dmg of a regular swing on high DEF mobs), and elemental damage is often resisted so Subduer seems better there.

[fantasticdan]

I was under the impression the fire dmg put algol over the top, since it does a sizable amount of damage when it procs? Idk, no one uses GS in merit pt anyway.

[Tearshang]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

...You kidding me?

[Tulun]

Algol, in my eyes.

For DoT, it's gonna be a bit hard to tell. Algol fire dmg procs A LOT, and it can do over 30 dmg. (I'm pretty sure it's about a 33% proc rate, I could be wrong, but it sure feels like it...). Added crit dmg is nice, as is the delay, so both for pure DoT might in the end win (could easily parse it but I doubt anyone cares enough )

Too bad DoT is basically irrelevant to HNMs... and I can't fathom any reason to use Great Sword (except for shits and giggles) in merit pts.

You can't crit hit on Spinning Slash (outside of SA). So, the +crit trait is out. Same base dmg. But, Algol has a chance to do a Triple Attacked WS, which can result in a huge, unresisted Light. So, in end, Algol > Subduer.

Of course, I personally think Martial GS will net more consistant WS either way...

[Rocl]

Algol looks a thousand times cooler

[Trythison]

Algol looks a thousand times cooler

Of what you say...there is no question.

[LinktheDeme]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

...You kidding me?

There is no way youd even come close to a good thf mnk nin or war with gsword, in fact drk class probably couldnt unless he has ass loads of epic gear and has good axes with /nin (maybe even ridill too? Not sure of sword skill diff on drk and war). I Call bullshit or really bad wars/thieves/whatever the fuck your pting with

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

...You kidding me?

There is no way youd even come close to a good thf mnk nin or war with gsword, in fact drk class probably couldnt unless he has ass loads of epic gear and has good axes with /nin (maybe even ridill too? Not sure of sword skill diff on drk and war). I Call bullshit or really bad wars/thieves/whatever the fuck your pting with

You don't know what I was referring to.

Meriting with Gswd is what I was referring to.

And a good scythe build will do better than a non-ridill dual wield build on DRK. Ask ruke or ryko, srsly.

[cassiraa]

If you're using a G.Sword you're probably using it for skillchains exclusivly. If you're using it for Weaponskills only, Algol has higher base damage and a slight chance to increase your TP gain.

Subduer seems a better weapon for the Crit rate, but if you're in a situation where you want to use a GSword: Algol helps for the reason you equipped a great sword to begin with, imho.

[Trythison]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

...You kidding me?

There is no way youd even come close to a good thf mnk nin or war with gsword, in fact drk class probably couldnt unless he has ass loads of epic gear and has good axes with /nin (maybe even ridill too? Not sure of sword skill diff on drk and war). I Call bullshit or really bad wars/thieves/whatever the fuck your pting with

You don't know what I was referring to.

Meriting with Gswd is what I was referring to.

And a good scythe build will do better than a non-ridill dual wield build on DRK. Ask ruke or ryko, srsly.

Wait.....











Ruke =/= Ryko?

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

If you're using a G.Sword you're probably using it for skillchains exclusivly. If you're using it for Weaponskills only, Algol has higher base damage and a slight chance to increase your TP gain.

Subduer seems a better weapon for the Crit rate, but if you're in a situation where you want to use a GSword: Algol helps for the reason you equipped a great sword to begin with, imho.

Really, is bothering to post in a thread where I already posted about DRK necessary?

You know I'll just give you shit for it.

[Xavier]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

...You kidding me?

There is no way youd even come close to a good thf mnk nin or war with gsword, in fact drk class probably couldnt unless he has ass loads of epic gear and has good axes with /nin (maybe even ridill too? Not sure of sword skill diff on drk and war). I Call bullshit or really bad wars/thieves/whatever the fuck your pting with

Dude he said he was 3rd out of 4 on the parser. I don't know where the bullshit is if hes claiming to be one of the weaker members of the party.

[buttermilk]

I prefer Algol when I merit with my greatsword on DRK. The triple attack procs more than one would think and yes the add. effect is decent. I was able to keep up on parse with thf's and wars at colibri merit camp as 2nd or 3rd ranked damage output out of 4. Dualling axe's I can get about 2% more dmg if I recall correctly so i just stick with GS since it's my fav weapon class.

...You kidding me?

There is no way youd even come close to a good thf mnk nin or war with gsword, in fact drk class probably couldnt unless he has ass loads of epic gear and has good axes with /nin (maybe even ridill too? Not sure of sword skill diff on drk and war). I Call bullshit or really bad wars/thieves/whatever the fuck your pting with

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w...seikyuuwar.jpg

Eikyuu is a war who is Above 90% of the warriors on fenrir imo(man/joy) Joram is 1 of the better sams i've partied with then me on drk along with rdm whm and cor... this is with Algol(the triple attck +3 seems to be much more than 3% but who knows maybe i was lucky) i am on Drk/sam i have 19% haste in gear + haste + fighters roll + chaos roll.... for the record with enough haste i dont think most wars can Out dd a drk who haste gear and above average armor, using a scythe(most wars do not include ridill ebody and such) and no i do not exp on drk/sam with GS ever cause it defeats the purpose of sycthe merrits and scythe > GS anyday no questions asked.

Edit:Drk/sam only if you have a whm... (this parse was on colibri)