Test Results (Sublimation and Elemental Siphon)

[safer]

Sublimation testing

RDM/SCH
Activate Sublimation- 2hp/tick
total HP drained 276hp (7min to reach the cap)
280mp restored

note: refresh does not stack with it, and using sublimation overwrites refresh!
Stoneskin stops the drain effect and allows you to rest. I dont know what SE was talking about not filling up while being it, because i was fighting a bat and my hp was still going down steadily... i didnt test however if i received the full effect of the sublimation. might need to look into that.

SCH37
total hp drained 130 (3:15min to reach that cap)
132 mp restored

*Ballad and Evoker's rolls DO stack with sublimation

Analysis: Refresh is still better to have on if there is a redmage around (in 6minutes refresh restores 300mp), however before starting a big fight, it'd be wise to store up a full mp pool so that as soon as you use up 280mp, you would recover it back, and then keep refresh on.

Elemental Siphon testing

naked 75 SMN - 256 smn skill (uncapped lol)
Firesday:
Firespirit = 226mp siphoned
Waterspirit = 206mp siphoned
Icespirit = 185 mp siphoned
Earthspirit = 206mp

281 smn skill (af2 hands+10 / evoker ring+10 / evoker's horn+5)
Earthspirit = 231 mp
Firespirit = 254mp

Earthsday:
276 skill (af2 hands / evoker ring)
Earthspirit = 248mp
Firespirit = 226mp
Thunderspirit = 203mp

266 smn skill
Earthspirit = 237mp
Firespirit = 216mp
Thunderspirit = 194mp

261skill
Airspirit = 211mp
Earthspirit = 232mp
Thunderspirit = 189mp

for the neutral elemental it looks like [Summoning Skill - 50 = Mp Recovered]

someone else figure out the bonus / penalty for using elemental of the day and opposing elemental plz D:

also elemental staves do not affect siphon

Still need to test:
Weather effects and elementals corresponding / opposing the weather (in combination with elemental day)


EDIT:

wind weather just popped in Al Zahbi

281 skill
Earthsday / Wind weather
Airspirit = 254mp = the same amount recovered as an earth elemental on earthsday
Earthspirit = 231mp = same as a neutral element ; ie the weather cancelled out the day effect
Icespirit = 231mp ; neutral element


still need to test:
weather and day coincide, double weather and day oppose / coincide

[Seyrr]

Simple arithmetic. Using the element of the day gets a 10% bonus. Using the element weak to that day's element gets a 10% penalty. Also, it looks like it changed to Earthday during your test, and you didn't say that. Is that correct?

Edit: With your additional weather effects, I'll go out on a limb and say that in general:

Elemental Siphon MP recovered = SMN skill - 50
For each weather effect/day that matches the spirit, add 10%
For each weather effect/day that is strong to the spirit, subtract 10%

[safer]

oops my first copy had the it noted where the day changed, fixed that,

and ya looking at it now 10% seems right, i think i was tryin to go too deep into the math and started getting weird percentages

[Aldaris]

I adujusted my smn skill to get a final test for day only no weather effects.

-Staffs, no effect
-Attributes(summoner), no effect
-obis, no effect

Test 1

Day: Windsday
Weather: None
Spirit: wind Spirit

Smn Skill @325 gained 302 MP

Test 2

Day: Thundersday
Weather: None
Spirit: Thunder Spirit

Smn Skill @325 gained 302 MP

Test 3

Day: Thundersday
Weather: None
Spirit: Thunder Spirit

Smn Skill @327 gained 304 MP

I belive for ever 1 smn skill after cap. 1 Smn skill = 1 mp.

I have yet to test weather/double effects to the same day etc.

[Seyrr]

I adujusted my smn skill to get a final test for day only no weather effects.

-Staffs, no effect
-Attributes(summoner), no effect
-obis, no effect

Test 1

Day: Windsday
Weather: None
Spirit: wind Spirit

Smn Skill @325 gained 302 MP

Test 2

Day: Thundersday
Weather: None
Spirit: Thunder Spirit

Smn Skill @325 gained 302 MP

Test 3

Day: Thundersday
Weather: None
Spirit: Thunder Spirit

Smn Skill @327 gained 304 MP

I belive for ever 1 smn skill after cap. 1 Smn skill = 1 mp.

I have yet to test weather/double effects to the same day etc.

That's a bit unfortunate - if you had, you might have noticed the pattern you found breaking. Every single test you did was of a spirit on its elemental day, which was already shown to be higher than the return for a day-neutral element. Your results are also consistent with MP returned = (SMN skill - 50) * 1.1 (that is, 10% bonus for spirit matching day).

[Gergall]

You stated that refresh is better because it restores 300 MP over 6 minutes. That's great for you but since it costs the RDM 80 MP (two castings of Refresh), the net effect is about the same.

[Toth]

Looks like SMNs are going to need to bring new ES sets.

[Amastacia]

You stated that refresh is better because it restores 300 MP over 6 minutes. That's great for you but since it costs the RDM 80 MP (two castings of Refresh), the net effect is about the same.

Refresh still has an edge.

In 150 seconds, Refresh restores 150 MP. Including the 40 MP casting cost, you recover 110 MP.

In 150 seconds, Sublimation restores ~100 MP. There is no casting cost, but you're also out 100 HP. There's a number of ways to not be out that HP (generally important for RDM sooner or later due to Convert), but the cheapest is Stoneskin at 350 MP recovered with 29 MP spent to keep HP stable. That's a shade over 8 MP per 100, or in other words with everything else held constant you recover ~92 MP to Refresh's 110.

~18 MP per 2.5 minutes is ~72 per unmerited Convert cycle, which, while not earth shattering, is significant.

[Khamsin]

Looks like SMNs are going to need to bring new ES sets.

Not really, other than the skill gear you already have for other reasons.

[Indalecia]

k, between windows:

Ice Spirit, Ice day, 292 smn skill = 266mp
Ice Spirit, Ice day, 330 smn skill = 308mp
Light Spirit, Ice day, 292 smn skill = 242mp
Light Spirit, Ice day, 330 smn skill = 280mp
Fire Spirit, Ice day, 292 smn skill = 242mp
Wind Spirit, Ice day, 292 smn skill = 217mp
Wind Spirit, Ice day, 330 smn skill = 252mp

So yeah, adding up, only thing I wanna try now is obi's, but only one I got on me atm is Dark obi. Ill try after Fluffy.

[Sodalitas]

Just conducted a small Elemental Siphon test since it was Iceday and Uleguerand Range very frequently has double ice weather.

325 Summoning Skill
Ice Elemental, Iceday, no weather: 302 MP recovered
Ice Elemental, Iceday, 1 ice weather: 330 MP recovered
Ice Elemental, Iceday, 2 ice weather: 371 MP recovered
Dark Elemental, Iceday, 1 ice weather: 275 MP recovered
Dark Elemental, Iceday, 2 ice weather: 275 MP recovered

285 Summoning Skill
Ice Elemental, Iceday, 1 ice weather: 282 MP recovered
Air Elemental, Iceday, no weather: 211 MP recovered
Air Elemental, Iceday, 1 ice weather: 188 MP recovered
Air Elemental, Lightningsday, 1 ice weather: 211 recovered

Seems like there's a 10% bonus for correct day or correct weather, possibly 25% bonus if double weather (someone test double correct weather and neutral day?), for a total of 35% bonus if correct day and double weather.

[Ashokan]

Dynamis: Double Dark - Firesday through Windsday

Skill: 326
MP: 345

Looks like you are correct about the 25% bonus for double weather.

If I was thinking more clearly I would've tried a light spirit to see if it was a -25% bonus instead of the standard -20%, I'm sure it is.

[Chen]

tried this with 280 and 290 skill windsday with water element 2x with each skill and got

280skill 253 mp x2
290skill 264 mp x2

so is it 1.1mp/skill over the cap then? or am i missing something. Also not affected by having different mp or hp (tried with 300hp +mp once, and full hp & 1k mp but got same results)

[whoami]

did some testing on sublimation as a sch/rdm and sch/blm.
Always drains 25% of your current max hp.
Tested once with no +hp gear gear took 25% hp (201)
tested with +90 hp gear took 25% hp (223 i think it was)

Af head makes it 3hp a tic drain.
essentailly the max mp stored and the time to reach cap will be based on max hp. What i havent tested yet is wether adding hp gear after its started would influence this somehow. (cause various gears add/subtract hp).
This could be usefull for mages as it always stops at 75% hp if you started at 100% to activate latent ears/rings and also could prevent sleep if its still draining hp. (click off SS if you have it).
Anyways basic formula you could probly say now is [.25*(max hp current?)]/40 (60 if sch main with af hat). For example use 1000 max hp it basickly puts it at 6 minutes and 15 seconds to hit that cap if /sch. If 60+ sch with af head it would put this example at 4 minutes and 10 (9 cause it rounds to exactly 75%) seconds.

Ill test adding hp gear in during it to see what i get.

[Ashokan]

tried this with 280 and 290 skill windsday with water element 2x with each skill and got

280skill 253 mp x2
290skill 264 mp x2

so is it 1.1mp/skill over the cap then? or am i missing something. Also not affected by having different mp or hp (tried with 300hp +mp once, and full hp & 1k mp but got same results)

You must have tried this during single water weather.

The tested formula is:

• Summoning magic skill - 50
  [list:2gi194yx]
• 10% is added per every weather effect and day that matches the spirit.[/*:m:2gi194yx]
• An extra 5% bonus is added for double weather e.g. dark spirit on double dark weather is 25% bonus instead of 20%[/*:m:2gi194yx]
• 10% is subtracted per every weather and day that is in opposition to the spirit.[/*:m:2gi194yx]

[/*:m:2gi194yx][*]After the weather and day effects are added/subtracted, the amount of MP recovered is truncated.[/*:m:2gi194yx][/list:u:2gi194yx]

The formula is supported by all the testing in this thread. For the testing numbers on the 5% bonus, see Sodalitas and my last posts.

[Gergall]

You stated that refresh is better because it restores 300 MP over 6 minutes. That's great for you but since it costs the RDM 80 MP (two castings of Refresh), the net effect is about the same.

Refresh still has an edge.

In 150 seconds, Refresh restores 150 MP. Including the 40 MP casting cost, you recover 110 MP.

In 150 seconds, Sublimation restores ~100 MP. There is no casting cost, but you're also out 100 HP. There's a number of ways to not be out that HP (generally important for RDM sooner or later due to Convert), but the cheapest is Stoneskin at 350 MP recovered with 29 MP spent to keep HP stable. That's a shade over 8 MP per 100, or in other words with everything else held constant you recover ~92 MP to Refresh's 110.

~18 MP per 2.5 minutes is ~72 per unmerited Convert cycle, which, while not earth shattering, is significant.

Thanks. I got fooled by the OP stating that refresh is 300 MP over 6 minutes when it's really over 5 minutes.

[Darcatvar]

Should test if the sea elemental obis can lock in the weather bonus for the smns.

[Ashokan]

Should test if the sea elemental obis can lock in the weather bonus for the smns.

Sea obis have no effect.

[Khamsin]

Should test if the sea elemental obis can lock in the weather bonus for the smns.

Sea obis have no effect.

However, the proc rate for the bonus seems pretty good so far. It could be 100%, without the obis.

[Ashokan]

Should test if the sea elemental obis can lock in the weather bonus for the smns.

Sea obis have no effect.

However, the proc rate for the bonus seems pretty good so far. It could be 100%, without the obis.

I'm fairly certain the proc rate is 100%. I haven't seen it not proc. Only time I didn't receive the complete mp that I was expecting was when I didn't switch to summoning magic skill gear fast enough -or- I had too much mp to receive the full amount.