When we ban guns in the US

**Churchill** · 2012-12-14 21:18

let's make sure to ban our Government from having them too. I know we've had the discussion about detachment from tragedies befallen those you aren't personally effected by. I know it's human nature.

When I see a man on TV crying for children he does not know, while labeling children he does not know as combatants in order to fit the rules of engagement, I am appalled.

In before this:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mo...tas---fox-news

US Military Says Killing Afghan Children Is Fair Game
http://nuclear-news.net/2012/12/08/u...-is-fair-game/

…a Marine official here raised questions about whether the children were “innocent.” Before calling for the M142 High Mobility Artillery Rocket System mission in mid-October, Marines observed the children digging a hole in a dirt road in Nawa district, the official said, and the Taliban may have recruited the children to carry out the mission.

U.S. Sergeant Is Said to Kill 16 Civilians in Afghanistan
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/12/wo...anted=all&_r=0

PANJWAI, Afghanistan — Stalking from home to home, a United States Army sergeant methodically killed at least 16 civilians, 9 of them children, in a rural stretch of southern Afghanistan early on Sunday, igniting fears of a new wave of anti-American hostility, Afghan and American officials said.

US attack kills 5 Afghan kids
http://www.salon.com/2012/05/08/us_a...5_afghan_kids/

several reports from Afghanistan that as many as 20 civilians were killed by two NATO airstrikes, including a mother and her five children. Today, the U.S. confirmed at least some of those claims, acknowledging and apologizing for its responsibility for the death of that family

Another NATO Strike Kills 14 Afghan Civilians in Khost; Second Incident of Civilian Killings in Khost in 3 Days
http://news.antiwar.com/2011/07/07/a...ians-in-khost/

NATO air strikes in the Khost Province district of Shamal this morning killed at least 14 civilians including eight children. It was the second strike in the province this week, with a Tuesday attack killing as many as 11 other civilians.

NATO Troops Kill 12-Year-Old Afghan Girl, Police Officer in Overnight Raid
http://news.antiwar.com/2011/05/12/n...vernight-raid/

Officials said they were targeting a Taliban suspect in the region but apologized after they realized they had the wrong house, and after they had killed two people. The father of the slain girl, who owned the house, says she was killed when the troops threw a grenade at her.

US-Supported Afghan Militias Commit Widespread Human Rights Abuses
http://news.antiwar.com/2011/09/12/u...rights-abuses/

The report “documents serious abuses, such as killings, rape, arbitrary detention, abductions, forcible land grabs, and illegal raids by irregular armed groups in northern Kunduz province and the Afghan Local Police (ALP).” The governments of the United States and of Afghanistan have not only failed to hold these forces to account, but they have fostered future abuses and generated more support for the Taliban and the insurgency, the report finds.

The ALP has been accused of “beating teenage boys and hammering nails into the feet of one boy,” although no arrests were made. “In April,” the report documents, “four armed ALP members in Baghlan abducted a 13-year-old boy on his way home from the bazaar and took him to the house of an ALP sub-commander, where he was gang raped.” The perpetrators are well known, but no arrests have been made.

Family: US Troops Killed Civilians in Latest Afghan Night Raid
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/02/12/f...an-night-raid/

According to family members of the victims, an overnight NATO raid against an Afghan house killed at least five civilians, three of them women, who were having a party at the time.

NATO Kills Four Children in Afghan Attack
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/09/29/n...afghan-attack/

NATO attack helicopters targeted a group of civilians in an orchard near the town of Andar, killing four children and wounding three other civilians.

UN Report: 346 Afghan Children Killed in 2009, Mostly by NATO
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/02/24/u...ostly-by-nato/

NATO was quick to brag that they had actually killed fewer civilians than the Taliban. This appears to be the case still, though UN reports suggested the difference wasn’t nearly as dramatic as NATO initially claimed. There is one thing the Taliban can’t compete with NATO on, however, and that’s the killing of children.

According to a report released today by the United Nations, some 346 Afghan children were killed in the fighting in 2009, around 15 percent of the overall civilian toll.

Military: 15 women, children killed in Iraq operation
http://articles.cnn.com/2007-10-11/w...mb?_s=PM:WORLD

Fifteen Iraqi civilians -- all women and children -- were killed by coalition forces during an operation targeting senior leaders of al Qaeda in Iraq, according to the U.S. military

The Children of Iraq: “Was the Price Worth It?”
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-chi...worth-it/30760

Iraq has turned into one of the worst places for children in the Middle East and North Africa with around 3.5 million living in poverty, 1.5 million under the age of five undernourished and 100 infants dying every day...

...The Occupying powers bear full responsibility for the violations of these provisions and Conventions related to children. They should be held fully accountable for the harm they have inflicted upon the Iraqi children. They have deliberately changed the social fabric of the country, used ethnic cleansing to break up the unity of the country, destroyed water purification systems, health and educational facilities and indiscriminately bombed dense populated areas, leaving the children extremely vulnerable on all levels...

The most realistic and scientific estimate of war-related deaths comes from justForeignPolicy.org, claiming 1.455.590 victims in January 2011[6].

Analysis[7] carried out for the research group Iraq Body Count found that 39% of those killed in air raids by the US-led coalition were children. Fatalities caused by mortars, used by American and Iraqi government forces as well as insurgents, were 42% children.[

WikiLeaks: Iraqi children in U.S. raid shot in head, U.N. says
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/08/3...ren-in-us.html

A U.S. diplomatic cable made public by WikiLeaks provides evidence that U.S. troops executed at least 10 Iraqi civilians, including a woman in her 70s and a 5-month-old infant, then called in an airstrike to destroy the evidence, during a controversial 2006 incident in the central Iraqi town of Ishaqi.

Read more here: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/08/3...#storylink=cpy

Torture, killing, children shot – and how the US tried to keep it all quiet

A detainee tortured with live electrical wires here, children shot by US troops at a checkpoint there, insurgents using children to carry out suicide bombings somewhere else; on and on, through 391,832 documents. At the Pentagon, these messages were the day-to-day commonplaces of staff inboxes; for Iraqis, they detail, in the emotionless jargon of the US military, nothing less than the hacking open of a nation's veins.

Military: 15 women, children killed in Iraq operation
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/...int/index.html

Fifteen Iraqi civilians -- all women and children -- were killed by coalition forces during an operation targeting senior leaders of al Qaeda in Iraq, according to the U.S. military, which claimed the victims were put in harm's way through the actions of the terrorist group.

9 children killed in US raid in Iraq
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/world/2...nt_6167184.htm

A US attack killed 19 insurgents and 15 civilians, including nine children, northwest of the capital Thursday - one of the heaviest civilian death tolls in an American operation in recent months.

Dozens of Children Killed in Iraq Attack
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2004Sep30.html

Majeed Aboud turned his tear-stained face to the body of his 5-year-old son, Mohammad, one of at least 34 children killed when a car bomb exploded as they gathered around U.S. soldiers handing out candy and cakes in a southern Baghdad neighborhood.

U.S. military 'regrets' killing 2 children in Iraq operation
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/me...ain/index.html

U.S. military "sincerely regrets" that it killed two children in a helicopter attack on militants linked to a suspected al Qaeda in Iraq leader

Why do we ignore the civilians killed in American wars?
http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2...-year-conflict

This inattention to civilian deaths in America’s wars isn’t unique to Iraq. There’s little evidence that the American public gives much thought to the people who live in the nations where our military interventions take place. Think about the memorials on the Mall honoring American sacrifices in Korea and Vietnam. These are powerful, sacred spots, but neither mentions the people of those countries who perished in the conflicts.

The major wars the United States has fought since the surrender of Japan in 1945 — in Korea, Indochina, Iraq and Afghanistan — have produced colossal carnage. For most of them, we do not have an accurate sense of how many people died, but a conservative estimate is at least 6 millioncivilians and soldiers.

**Rhinox** · 2012-12-14 21:21

Sign me up!

**hey** · 2012-12-14 21:23

Laws don't apply to the government, idiot.

**Howie Roary** · 2012-12-14 21:24

**Rhinox** · 2012-12-14 21:24

But in all seriousness we don't need to ban them from the government just pressure them into stop being world police.

It effectively does the same thing.

**Churchill** · 2012-12-14 21:33

Originally Posted by Rhinox

Sign me up!

Originally Posted by Rhinox

But in all seriousness we don't need to ban them from the government just pressure them into stop being world police.

It effectively does the same thing.

Si, turn your dusted off Apathy into something universally useful, instead of just knee-jerk or Fox News incited.

Originally Posted by hey

Laws don't apply to the government, idiot.

Yes, when President Obama shed tears my gag reflex kicked in.

**Rhinox** · 2012-12-14 21:34

I don't get it

**RKenshin** · 2012-12-14 21:37

ib4 ban children?

**Churchill** · 2012-12-14 21:39

Originally Posted by Rhinox

I don't get it

I was agreeing with you, eat a deep dish pie in celebration.

**Rhinox** · 2012-12-14 21:40

I'm not following you please explain

**tyven** · 2012-12-14 21:42

damn churchy, how long did it take you to make that post? that a lot of linkage

**Churchill** · 2012-12-14 21:45

Spoiler: show

**Churchill** · 2012-12-14 21:45

Originally Posted by tyven

damn churchy, how long did it take you to make that post? that a lot of linkage

you'd be surprised how easy it was to find the articles.

**Rhinox** · 2012-12-14 21:46

Lots of research and formating. I agree

Only reason I posted tbh. Didn't want all his hard work go to waste

**quannum** · 2012-12-14 21:51

3d printers

Tagus · 2012-12-14 21:54

Anybody watching CNN right now? Piers Morgan has a gun lobbyist on his show, and they are literally fucking screaming at each other. At one point the lobbyist is like "when England banned guns, gun murders went up".... Morgan's response... "THAT'S BECAUSE WE HAD 35 MURDERS IN OUR ENTIRE COUNTRY BEFORE THE BAN"

And then, chaos.

**tyven** · 2012-12-14 22:03

i currently work with the former head lobbyist for NRA. I've never asked him why he left. I assume its because he is good enough to run his own shop and make a killing, but I like to think its because he wanted his soul back. of course now he represents the financial services industry so some might call it a wash.

**Milkster** · 2012-12-14 23:10

Oh mai gawd Churchill, don't be an idiot. They're totally different thangs!
I laughed when I was infracted earlier for making this point in that thread.

**6souls** · 2012-12-14 23:15

When we ban guns...

I've always liked Chris Rock's solution

**Rhyis.** · 2012-12-15 03:24

America just needs to be less aggressive with their world policing. It's possible to be a peacekeeper nation without being a douche about it... Maybe that isn't possible for the US though, you dudes like your killing, I dunno.

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