Why do people argue SMN has low DPS?

[zsuper]

Has anyone actually theory crafted it?
When I suggested that SMN does too much DPS, I immediately had retards screaming that SMN is the lowest DPS in the game, parsers don't work, etc.

I worked out some rough values and ffxivapp is giving me what look like correct numbers, and my DPS is definitely higher than every other class. This is considering that we're all in ilevel 60/70 gear with one piece AF2 and relic.

[shepardG]

cool story!

you realize you posted nothing backing that statement up, so when we bust your stupid balls, don't get butt hurt.

[zsuper]

cool story!

you realize you posted nothing backing that statement up, so when we bust your stupid balls, don't get butt hurt.

There's nothing to prove SMN does low DPS, either.
Maybe you should make up some numbers, instead of screaming 'OMG SMN SUCKS LOW DMG I CAN'T THEORYCRAFT.'

I just spent 10 minutes at a dummy in Coerthas:
Ruin averaged 177.3 damage, 2.3 second cast
Bio + Bio II + Miasma averaged 260 damage, every 2 seconds (this included criticals).
Fester averaged 659.7 every 20 seconds
Garuda averaged 177.4 every 3 seconds

In total, this is 299.19 DPS.
It's offset by having to recast DoTs, but also keep in mind that the non-DoT damage isn't considering a 10% crit rate. In my experience, most other DPS are hovering around 180.

Using xivapp with Garuda on Obey (lower damage than actual), I parsed 249 DPS. This is without food, Requiem, or the party INT buff.

[shepardG]

better. closer. warmer.

also never said smn does low dps low. I'm actually more inclined to the idea that SE actually did get class balancing fairly close. We'll see of course though.

but napkin math probably not gonna cut it around here, imo. be glad i got to you first before some others did.

[zsuper]

better. closer. warmer.

also never said smn does low dps low. I'm actually more inclined to the idea that SE actually did get class balancing fairly close. We'll see of course though.

but napkin math probably not gonna cut it around here, imo. be glad i got to you first before some others did.

Some others can tell me what's wrong and give their own numbers.
So far, I haven't seen anything to back up that SMN is low.

Atm you're bringing nothing to this thread.

[Seravi Edalborez]

Even if SMN's overall DPS can compete with that of other DDs, they fall flat in one department spectacularly: burst damage. For adds that need to die yesterday, SMN can't really do it.

[xopher]

Some others can tell me what's wrong and give their own numbers.
So far, I haven't seen anything to back up that SMN is low.

Atm you're bringing nothing to this thread.

If you're going to start making comparisons, then do them. Don't expect others to bring their own data to disprove you. If you have something to prove, bring both sides of the equation or get out.

[zsuper]

If you're going to start making comparisons, then do them. Don't expect others to bring their own data to disprove you. If you have something to prove, bring both sides of the equation or get out.

Just curious, how do you bring both sides of the equation when you don't know why people are claiming SMN has low DPS and nobody will explain or give any statistics?

This thread is currently just 'NAW, YOU'RE WRONG, SMN DPS IS BAD.' I legitimately want to know why people think this.
I remember during FFXI that BG was a good place to discuss this and get both sides. What's happening in this thread right now is just short of retardation.

[shepardG]

NOT A SINGLE PERSON HAS SAID YOU ARE WRONG. Not a single one. Get out.

[Churchill]

Because when people play with them they do really poorly and the runs are slower, the link is made to the Summoner being present because they are the new variable.

I have made this claim myself, but made the caveat that I haven't played the class and it was based entirely on parses of other people.

--

I'd be more interested in you recording every tick of your spells individually (about 100 ticks each) and obtaining an average damage of non-criticals.

[Churchill]

Then again you sound hella butthurt so ya bro, SMN is tits.

[zsuper]

Because when people play with them they do really poorly and the runs are slower, the link is made to the Summoner being present because they are the new variable.

I have made this claim myself, but made the caveat that I haven't played the class and it was based entirely on parses of other people.

--

I'd be more interested in you recording every tick of your spells individually (about 100 ticks each) and obtaining an average damage of non-criticals.

I'll agree that most SMN play it poorly.
I'm not sure what's considered a slow run, but my Amdapor Keep speed run times with an equally geared BRD are around 12 minutes; Demon Wall dies as or before it spawns flies and the shadow dragon dies shortly after or during the second Imminent Catastrophe.

I'll take time to catalog individual ticks later tonight.

[Churchill]

That would put you at less than or equal to other DDs in situations where there is a single target and minimal dodging. Again, this is entirely based on second hand information with no controls because I don't know if your Bard is tits or not and the only thing I do know is that Amdapor can be ran faster than that. (Though it isn't slow)

[Maaglin]

I heard this thread had tits.

Disappoint.

[zsuper]

That would put you at less than or equal to other DDs in situations where there is a single target and minimal dodging. Again, this is entirely based on second hand information with no controls because I don't know if your Bard is tits or not and the only thing I do know is that Amdapor can be ran faster than that. (Though it isn't slow)

BRD is a good player with equal gear. We don't have a DD limit break, which slows us down a bit on the first and second boss.

[chichicha]

IMO

SMN is not bad, just has nothing backup this statement
Most importantly...
Majority rushed into play this job, and still in the "Finding Phase" of how they can do the job right in instance.

And since under the "Finding stage", majority play it poorly and got the common comment from others -
SMN is lowest DPS...

It doesn't sound fair, but we , others DPS tank and healer are suffering the slow speed dungeon with SMN at the moment.

When time passed, and these SMN play it right, I'm sure it will be... then hoping SMN won't be a lolJOB in FF14.

[Aristio]

When time passed, and these SMN play it right, I'm sure it will be... then hoping SMN won't be a lolJOB in FF14.

I honestly don't remember a single pet-class in any MMO that wasn't the joke of the game. Dragoon in FFXI only became good after years of tweaking.

[Churchill]

I honestly don't remember a single pet-class in any MMO that wasn't the joke of the game. Dragoon in FFXI only became good after years of tweaking.

?_?

[Ksandra]

I honestly don't remember a single pet-class in any MMO that wasn't the joke of the game. Dragoon in FFXI only became good after years of tweaking.

Hunter has pretty much been OP since vanilla WoW....

And DRG was always good, just idiots didn't know because parsers didn't exist when they nerfed penta thrust.


Also, some people have gotta chill out. This isn't the theorycraft section.

[Siatdiat]

I honestly don't remember a single pet-class in any MMO that wasn't the joke of the game. Dragoon in FFXI only became good after years of tweaking.

In other words, you only ever played ffxi then? Your statement is incorrect in most other MMO out there, beginning with EQ.