Augmenting and total gil on server

[Etice]

Well tonight a heated debate started as to whether the new augment system is lowering the total gil on the server (SE's way or keeping things in check w/o us realizing it) or if it is actually creating gil, or keeping it all the average.

What is everybody's thoughts on this topic?

[Hanayaka]

I don't think any gil is lost through the augmenting system. I feel that as more people create terrible items, they NPC them for a quick 5~20k, thus generating more gil on the server and contributing to inflation.

The radically changing prices on items just changes the amount of gil that is transferred between people, but doesn't affect the total amount of gil on the server.

[Yugl]

Why would this system reduce the total amount of gil?

[Cream Soda]

Why would this system reduce the total amount of gil?

buy forager mantle, -350k shitty stats, npc +less than 350k. buy, repeat.

I've gone through 4 foragers now and nothing worth keeping

[Yugl]

buy forager mantle, -350k shitty stats, npc +less than 350k. buy, repeat.

I've gone through 4 foragers now and nothing worth keeping

The gil spent on the foragers transfers hands. It doesn't disappear.

[azagarth]

yes but that gil isnt "gone" from the game, it just changes hands. however you npcing the mantle adds the much into the game.

Thus you gave 350k to someone (no loss)
but npced an item (20k~ gain)

meaning after it is all said and done your out 330k, but the game just got 20k more put into it that would not have been there before.

[Cairthenn]

buy forager mantle, -350k shitty stats, npc +less than 350k. buy, repeat.

I've gone through 4 foragers now and nothing worth keeping

You do realise that Gil goes to someone else. This process is creating more Gil and getting rid of items.

[Thorny]

could argue about AH fees due to increased activity on those items, but it's all a drop in the bucket anyway

augmenting isn't significantly changing the amount of gil on servers

[kemigumi]

buy forager mantle, -350k shitty stats, npc +less than 350k. buy, repeat.

I've gone through 4 foragers now and nothing worth keeping

you've lost xxxK gil per forager and increased the amount of gil on the server by however much foragers have vendored for.
you are losing gil personally + creating gil for the server + creating a demand for foragers on AH... depending on how they sell could be inflating could be deflating... the market is stimulated currently with crafted items such as weskits, but items such as foragers which are drops will not make it back to market therefore creating an inflated market in the future. see warwolf belt @80k now as an example. it's too early to see how the economy will turn out but currently servers are making gil, regardless of the fact that you are spending all of yours (it's going to the seller).

[Cream Soda]

The gil spent on the foragers transfers hands. It doesn't disappear.

I paid 350k for it that doesn't come back to me because I can't sell it for 350k. Instead i get the NPC price for it.

Buy forager = other person get 350k
Sell forager = you get 350k
Augment forager = you get 1.8k (just checked now) for npc'ing it. = I can't sell for 350k = money that is gone.

Disappears in the fact that YOU can't resell it, it is no longer a tradable good.

[kemigumi]

I paid 350k for it that doesn't come back to me because I can't sell it for 350k. Instead i get the NPC price for it.

Buy forager = other person get 350k
Sell forager = you get 350k
Augment forager = you get 1.8k (just checked now) for npc'ing it. = I can't sell for 350k = money that is gone.

Disappears in the fact that YOU can't resell it, it is no longer a tradable good.

taking it out of a trade market is not reducing gil on server.
you are losing the 350k personally or potential profit on resale, which is gil already existing in a buyer's hand. the ah does not create gil.

[Cairthenn]

I paid 350k for it that doesn't come back to me because I can't sell it for 350k. Instead i get the NPC price for it.

Buy forager = other person get 350k
Sell forager = you get 350k
Augment forager = you get 1.8k (just checked now) for npc'ing it. = I can't sell for 350k = money that is gone.

Disappears in the fact that YOU can't resell it, it is no longer a tradable good.

We're speaking of total Gil. But as Thorny said, this has no significant impact on the amount of Gil on servers.

[Cantih]

Actually, between AH fees and NPC selling of unwanted pieces, the gil probably comes out somewhere between neutral, to a small increase in the gil supply.

What I think needs to be looked at is what Cairthenn said.
What this is doing, is removing ITEMS from the marketplace and game. How is that going to work out in the end?

[Ferien]

It's going to increase demand (and therefore, AH prices) for the popular items, as we've already seen with Warwolf Belt.

[Gergall]

If anything, items are disappearing from the game.

Less items and same gil
is the same as
Same items and more gil

We should expect inflation.

[yayajax]

It's going to increase demand (and therefore, AH prices) for the popular items, as we've already seen with Warwolf Belt.

I guess this sums up to a point, the minority people who can't make quick money can get back to do BCNM, even not getting those valuable items, we are not getting junks and actually normal items worth a few. Raising the overall "gil-per-seal" ratio. This should help balance the rich and poor a little as doing Augment gambling. Union drops have the same effect to balance the rich and poor but that would be under another topic.

[Asdrabael]

You guys aren't thinking about AH fee's. For some of the items, like foragers or genie weskit, they sell for vastly more than the NPC price.

Whats the tax on 1.8mill to auction it?

If gives back 1500 gil? It sounds like more actual gil did leave the server from auction house fee's. Even items like warwolf belt. If it hits 80-100k, whats the fees? How much do they npc for? As demand and prices rice, more gil is eatten in auction fee's.

Overall it probably breaks mostly even since not many people can spam foragers or spam genie weskits, or really spam something as expensive as a warwolf belt.

Its a pretty dead balancing act balancing the gil with those fee's.

[Thorny]

could argue about AH fees due to increased activity on those items, but it's all a drop in the bucket anyway

augmenting isn't significantly changing the amount of gil on servers

You guys aren't thinking about AH fee's. For some of the items, like foragers or genie weskit, they sell for vastly more than the NPC price.

hurrr

[Drako]

i think we should expect inflation on several itens that might have been more expansive in the past like weskits, nq staffs, some rings and earring and weapons (if it happens so that you can get really good aug weapons)

many itens have started to went up in price, soon i bet more ppl will start to synth again and we will see what happens.

[Etice]

here is the thinking on the debate. all items are gil, not items, so say flame ring costs 740k, Person A buys flame Flame ring (740k), augments, gets shit for the augment, so then NPCs the flame ring (740k) for 40k. How would that be shifting it all, the server loses 740k in item worth, but gains 40k for the 740k purchased off the AH. Then AH taxes take some out, but not all